Southampton expecting to receive a £16m offer from Arsenal for Calum Chambers after talks between clubs

Calum Chambers (left) in action for Saints

Calum Chambers (left) in action for Saints

First published in Sport
Last updated
Basingstoke Gazette: Photograph of the Author by , Senior Sports Reporter

SAINTS are understood to be bracing themselves for a £16m bid from Arsenal for right-back Calum Chambers.

Discussions are believed to have taken place between the clubs, although the Gunners are yet to formalise their offer for the 19-year-old.

Sources have indicated that is likely to happen soon, though, and the Daily Echo understands Saints have agreed to enter into the talks as the sum of money being spoken about represents a huge amount for a teenager who has just one season of first-team football under his belt.

The club also have Nathaniel Clyne in place, with the two players having split time almost equally at right-back last term.

Saints have been aware that they will, at some stage, need to make a long-term decision over who to proceed with in that position.

However, if they do agree to sell, there is no doubt that Chambers would be a big loss, having emerged as one of the brightest right-back talents in the country.

Petersfield-born Chambers, who has been with the club since the age of seven, is under contract at St Mary’s until 2017, having signed a new four-year deal last summer.

The teenager made his Premier League debut on the opening day of last season, helping Saints to a 1-0 win at West Brom.

England under-19 international Chambers, who missed tonight’s friendly at Bournemouth through illness, went on to make 18 starts in the competition and four substitute appearances.

Comments (832)

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11:04pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired!
Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired! Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 17

11:05pm Fri 25 Jul 14

SwissToni says...

Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now.
Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now. SwissToni
  • Score: 118

11:05pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Smith187 says...

Should be a no-brainer from the saints board not to sell, this is taking the **** now
Should be a no-brainer from the saints board not to sell, this is taking the **** now Smith187
  • Score: 85

11:06pm Fri 25 Jul 14

insider1234 says...

Can't we say no?
Can't we say no? insider1234
  • Score: 69

11:07pm Fri 25 Jul 14

MccSaint says...

I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.
I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day. MccSaint
  • Score: 73

11:12pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Baddesley Bill says...

Ok....time to draw the line now. Amazing bid, but we need a squad ffs.
Ok....time to draw the line now. Amazing bid, but we need a squad ffs. Baddesley Bill
  • Score: 68

11:12pm Fri 25 Jul 14

BarnetSaint says...

Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful. BarnetSaint
  • Score: 139

11:13pm Fri 25 Jul 14

montecristosaint says...

As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.
As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom. montecristosaint
  • Score: 75

11:13pm Fri 25 Jul 14

garyom71 says...

What's it coming too when even non first team regulars are being sold before ether have even had a proper chance to play for us. Last year we were seen as the shining lights of the Premier League, the club with the model that others should follow. Now the lights are shining not so brightly and the sheep are following some other Shepard!
What's it coming too when even non first team regulars are being sold before ether have even had a proper chance to play for us. Last year we were seen as the shining lights of the Premier League, the club with the model that others should follow. Now the lights are shining not so brightly and the sheep are following some other Shepard! garyom71
  • Score: 34

11:15pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Blue means Success says...

So, what are the fans going to do about it.

Just say - O well, and make a cup of tea - musn't grumble eh?

The Southampton way
So, what are the fans going to do about it. Just say - O well, and make a cup of tea - musn't grumble eh? The Southampton way Blue means Success
  • Score: 21

11:16pm Fri 25 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

MccSaint wrote:
I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.
Mugged again, I think we deserve an explanation and a pledge for the future don't you? I've tried my best to defend the Club and they do this?
Even the happiest clapper in the World has to question what is happening?
[quote][p][bold]MccSaint[/bold] wrote: I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.[/p][/quote]Mugged again, I think we deserve an explanation and a pledge for the future don't you? I've tried my best to defend the Club and they do this? Even the happiest clapper in the World has to question what is happening? OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 71

11:17pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

Very sad if it's true.
Very sad if it's true. Rising_Son
  • Score: 23

11:18pm Fri 25 Jul 14

03alpe01 says...

There will not be a fire-sale here- Les Reed
There will not be a fire-sale here- Les Reed 03alpe01
  • Score: 74

11:18pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Dave Brown says...

If this Daily Echo is correct,surely it is time for every supporter to ask the Board what the hell is going on within the club and what is behind this massive sell off.
How many clubs that finished above Saints last season have sold the backbone of their squad.
I have to say I am beginning wonder at the mindset of those at the top or whether any Directors are actually working within the club.
If this Daily Echo is correct,surely it is time for every supporter to ask the Board what the hell is going on within the club and what is behind this massive sell off. How many clubs that finished above Saints last season have sold the backbone of their squad. I have to say I am beginning wonder at the mindset of those at the top or whether any Directors are actually working within the club. Dave Brown
  • Score: 46

11:20pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

montecristosaint wrote:
As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.
I know I've said it before,but Lineker,Hansen and Shearer,seemed to think this was a forgone conclusion at the end of last season,when none of them had the right to believe anything of the sort...why??
[quote][p][bold]montecristosaint[/bold] wrote: As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.[/p][/quote]I know I've said it before,but Lineker,Hansen and Shearer,seemed to think this was a forgone conclusion at the end of last season,when none of them had the right to believe anything of the sort...why?? Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 35

11:24pm Fri 25 Jul 14

InCortesewetrust says...

We are NOT a selling club! Les reed
We are NOT a selling club! Les reed InCortesewetrust
  • Score: 53

11:25pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Jon Forte says...

When will this stop and at what point as fans will we say enough is enough! We're back in the realms of the Rupert L owe days now in terms of club distraction!

It's time to stand up on mass, take to the streets, and call for an overhaul of this board! If WE don't at least try and make ourselves heard , we may soon find ourselves with no club left to follow!!!
When will this stop and at what point as fans will we say enough is enough! We're back in the realms of the Rupert L owe days now in terms of club distraction! It's time to stand up on mass, take to the streets, and call for an overhaul of this board! If WE don't at least try and make ourselves heard , we may soon find ourselves with no club left to follow!!! Jon Forte
  • Score: 43

11:26pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Clever Dick says...

Make them pay £20million plus add ons. He's a great prospect but it' a very good price. I'm beginning to see why we've bought Pelle now. Apparently the light switches are pretty high up at St Marys so the last man there has to be able to reach so there is somebody to switch the lights out. And there I was thinking there was only one laughing stock of a club on the south coast. Its beginning to look like the board is intent on making it two.
Make them pay £20million plus add ons. He's a great prospect but it' a very good price. I'm beginning to see why we've bought Pelle now. Apparently the light switches are pretty high up at St Marys so the last man there has to be able to reach so there is somebody to switch the lights out. And there I was thinking there was only one laughing stock of a club on the south coast. Its beginning to look like the board is intent on making it two. Clever Dick
  • Score: 18

11:26pm Fri 25 Jul 14

oldsaintsfan says...

Chambers may well make a decent central defender one day. I thought we had got past the need to sell the kids as soon as they show any serious aptitude. Seems LS was not a one-off if this story is true – the board should hang their heads in shame– not sure what the bookies odds are on Saints being relegated but they must be shortening by the day.
Chambers may well make a decent central defender one day. I thought we had got past the need to sell the kids as soon as they show any serious aptitude. Seems LS was not a one-off if this story is true – the board should hang their heads in shame– not sure what the bookies odds are on Saints being relegated but they must be shortening by the day. oldsaintsfan
  • Score: 37

11:26pm Fri 25 Jul 14

bbb001 says...

Again another player who will move and have limited opportunity in the Arsenal 1st team, he can kiss goodbye to any chance of an England call up as he we only be playing the odd league cup game.
Again another player who will move and have limited opportunity in the Arsenal 1st team, he can kiss goodbye to any chance of an England call up as he we only be playing the odd league cup game. bbb001
  • Score: 17

11:27pm Fri 25 Jul 14

steekeemcglue says...

if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.
if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium. steekeemcglue
  • Score: 30

11:29pm Fri 25 Jul 14

RedPastramy says...

I think the club will be sold now that the assets are stripped. The worrying thing is that the youngsters game was cancelled as players promoted to the first team . So that must say something about the number of potential new arrivals . Not many I would say. Is it a case of keep the money and run..... I am a life time saints fan and it hurts to see what's going on. Good players out mediocre at best brought in
I think the club will be sold now that the assets are stripped. The worrying thing is that the youngsters game was cancelled as players promoted to the first team . So that must say something about the number of potential new arrivals . Not many I would say. Is it a case of keep the money and run..... I am a life time saints fan and it hurts to see what's going on. Good players out mediocre at best brought in RedPastramy
  • Score: 44

11:29pm Fri 25 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

steekeemcglue wrote:
if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.
I was voted an idiot in an earlier poll, count me in.
[quote][p][bold]steekeemcglue[/bold] wrote: if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.[/p][/quote]I was voted an idiot in an earlier poll, count me in. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 22

11:29pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............
. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said. costa gaz
  • Score: 29

11:29pm Fri 25 Jul 14

arthur boutfaith says...

No-one on the left
No-one on the riiiiight
By why should we worry?
At least our shirt's red and white
No-one on the left No-one on the riiiiight By why should we worry? At least our shirt's red and white arthur boutfaith
  • Score: 31

11:32pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

Saint 2701 wrote:
Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!!

Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going.

Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-(
Well,he'd better effin hurry up!
[quote][p][bold]Saint 2701[/bold] wrote: Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!! Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going. Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-([/p][/quote]Well,he'd better effin hurry up! Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 12

11:33pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Blue means Success says...

I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k Blue means Success
  • Score: -42

11:33pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

In a minute someone will come and say, that he was rubbish and Clyne is 100 times better and that we got a great price for a 19 year old.... we'll be signing better replacements for all of our departed players real soon ......ZZZZZZZZZZzzzz
zzzzzzzzzz..........
.........
In a minute someone will come and say, that he was rubbish and Clyne is 100 times better and that we got a great price for a 19 year old.... we'll be signing better replacements for all of our departed players real soon ......ZZZZZZZZZZzzzz zzzzzzzzzz.......... ......... costa gaz
  • Score: 27

11:35pm Fri 25 Jul 14

donni1437 says...

We're like the man from Del Monte..... I can't believe RK is happy or sanctions this sale, if this one is true.
We're like the man from Del Monte..... I can't believe RK is happy or sanctions this sale, if this one is true. donni1437
  • Score: 17

11:36pm Fri 25 Jul 14

SaintSteve76 says...

Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out! SaintSteve76
  • Score: 44

11:36pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Kamawoop says...

If true may be the best of the bad Saints news so far. Not that I don't rate Chambers - I do, but this is one position where we do have back-up. Chambers, or Clyne? Clyne offers more attacking options, but Chambers has the potential develop into a better player. Howerver are we really in the position to keep two £15m rated right-backs, only one of whom will play? If we had that money would it be worth it to spend that money on a very good squad player? No! We are strong in this position, let's put the fee to use improving our team with another winger and centre-back, or two.
If true may be the best of the bad Saints news so far. Not that I don't rate Chambers - I do, but this is one position where we do have back-up. Chambers, or Clyne? Clyne offers more attacking options, but Chambers has the potential develop into a better player. Howerver are we really in the position to keep two £15m rated right-backs, only one of whom will play? If we had that money would it be worth it to spend that money on a very good squad player? No! We are strong in this position, let's put the fee to use improving our team with another winger and centre-back, or two. Kamawoop
  • Score: 12

11:36pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

Blue means Success wrote:
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
I bet your thumbs down count will be about 250.
[quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k[/p][/quote]I bet your thumbs down count will be about 250. Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 16

11:37pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Woodgreen Saint says...

BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
We are Southampton the one stop supermarket for the BPL.
[quote][p][bold]BarnetSaint[/bold] wrote: Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful.[/p][/quote]We are Southampton the one stop supermarket for the BPL. Woodgreen Saint
  • Score: 29

11:38pm Fri 25 Jul 14

03alpe01 says...

Blue means Success wrote:
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
26-27 in total more like! No way would people turn up to watch what is effectively a grassroots team get mullered every week!
[quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k[/p][/quote]26-27 in total more like! No way would people turn up to watch what is effectively a grassroots team get mullered every week! 03alpe01
  • Score: 1

11:40pm Fri 25 Jul 14

bbb001 says...

Has Baldrick been appointed to the board as this might be part of a really cunning plan
Has Baldrick been appointed to the board as this might be part of a really cunning plan bbb001
  • Score: 31

11:42pm Fri 25 Jul 14

garyom71 says...

Blue means Success wrote:
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
An attendance your club could only ever dream of if true.
[quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k[/p][/quote]An attendance your club could only ever dream of if true. garyom71
  • Score: 16

11:43pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Blue means Success says...

03alpe01 wrote:
Blue means Success wrote:
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
26-27 in total more like! No way would people turn up to watch what is effectively a grassroots team get mullered every week!
I was being positive

If you end up selling Chambers, Spiderboy and say Clyne or Jayrod - I would imagine that the fans would have done nothing about it.
[quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k[/p][/quote]26-27 in total more like! No way would people turn up to watch what is effectively a grassroots team get mullered every week![/p][/quote]I was being positive If you end up selling Chambers, Spiderboy and say Clyne or Jayrod - I would imagine that the fans would have done nothing about it. Blue means Success
  • Score: 6

11:46pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
[quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys. costa gaz
  • Score: 13

11:47pm Fri 25 Jul 14

bathsaints says...

This is becoming a joke. What is going on behind the scenes. We have a manager with a great reputation and yet people queuing to leave, what is wrong. If we dont need to sell we shouldn't, hold players to thier contract at least another year. After lovren nobody else should go in this window. Im all for giving the kids ago but we are leaving ourselves threadbare. Did big Ron know all this when he signed up? Would be nice to have some open communication from board. Will always cheer the saints, totally behind the team come what may but to see such a promising team pulled apart with no explanation is heart wrenching. Come on board what's going on???
This is becoming a joke. What is going on behind the scenes. We have a manager with a great reputation and yet people queuing to leave, what is wrong. If we dont need to sell we shouldn't, hold players to thier contract at least another year. After lovren nobody else should go in this window. Im all for giving the kids ago but we are leaving ourselves threadbare. Did big Ron know all this when he signed up? Would be nice to have some open communication from board. Will always cheer the saints, totally behind the team come what may but to see such a promising team pulled apart with no explanation is heart wrenching. Come on board what's going on??? bathsaints
  • Score: 26

11:47pm Fri 25 Jul 14

03alpe01 says...

costa gaz wrote:
SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.[/p][/quote]I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back" 03alpe01
  • Score: 16

11:48pm Fri 25 Jul 14

vidman says...

I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down.
Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens
I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down. Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens vidman
  • Score: 23

11:49pm Fri 25 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

11:50pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Blue means Success says...

garyom71 wrote:
Blue means Success wrote:
I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k
An attendance your club could only ever dream of if true.
Expansion plans are on the board

On your club - It just seems people are losing interest
[quote][p][bold]garyom71[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: I bet your average attendance this year will be around 26-27k[/p][/quote]An attendance your club could only ever dream of if true.[/p][/quote]Expansion plans are on the board On your club - It just seems people are losing interest Blue means Success
  • Score: -8

11:51pm Fri 25 Jul 14

bloke from bitterene park says...

this is getting silly now , that fat swiss bird is just trying to make loads of money before flogging the club to some one , see you next season bournemouth ! :( i want my season ticket money back .
this is getting silly now , that fat swiss bird is just trying to make loads of money before flogging the club to some one , see you next season bournemouth ! :( i want my season ticket money back . bloke from bitterene park
  • Score: -8

11:51pm Fri 25 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

03alpe01 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"
Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.
[quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.[/p][/quote]I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"[/p][/quote]Don't worry at least we have the stripes back. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 19

11:52pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............


. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes.
Nor mine, but I took a lot of flack from you and many others because of what I believed this was happening.
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes.[/p][/quote]Nor mine, but I took a lot of flack from you and many others because of what I believed this was happening. costa gaz
  • Score: 39

11:52pm Fri 25 Jul 14

saintmac says...

The OS says Lovren is sick. Who now believes anything the Board says?
It is obvious Chambers has been in London. For pitys sake,KL, sell theClub to somebody who may possibly care. We have an inept Board and an owner who may initially have been interested but now just wants to sell up and make a profit.All that talk about tears in her eyes when talking about her Fathers connections with the Club and how she wanted to bring a smile to the fans faces appear to be just that - all talk. The fans have certainly got tears in their eyes. THE FANS HAVE BEEN CONNED. Its Mr Koeman I feel sorry for as he will be blamed if we are
relegated and this is now more than likely.
The OS says Lovren is sick. Who now believes anything the Board says? It is obvious Chambers has been in London. For pitys sake,KL, sell theClub to somebody who may possibly care. We have an inept Board and an owner who may initially have been interested but now just wants to sell up and make a profit.All that talk about tears in her eyes when talking about her Fathers connections with the Club and how she wanted to bring a smile to the fans faces appear to be just that - all talk. The fans have certainly got tears in their eyes. THE FANS HAVE BEEN CONNED. Its Mr Koeman I feel sorry for as he will be blamed if we are relegated and this is now more than likely. saintmac
  • Score: 21

11:53pm Fri 25 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

vidman wrote:
I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down.
Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens
If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more.
[quote][p][bold]vidman[/bold] wrote: I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down. Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens[/p][/quote]If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 0

11:53pm Fri 25 Jul 14

one in the crowd says...

Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership. one in the crowd
  • Score: 16

11:54pm Fri 25 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Someone over in Southampton needs to arrange a protest!
Someone over in Southampton needs to arrange a protest! BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 22

11:54pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
03alpe01 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"
Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.
Just about sums you up. Good grief
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.[/p][/quote]I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"[/p][/quote]Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.[/p][/quote]Just about sums you up. Good grief costa gaz
  • Score: 5

11:55pm Fri 25 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
vidman wrote:
I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down.
Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens
If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more.
Have you been drinking?
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vidman[/bold] wrote: I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down. Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens[/p][/quote]If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more.[/p][/quote]Have you been drinking? costa gaz
  • Score: 3

11:57pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Mister E says...

montecristosaint wrote:
As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.
"....but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up"
Perhaps they did look, and there was nothing to see! With nothing to report, no report was written! With no report to read, that may be why you've not read it!
[quote][p][bold]montecristosaint[/bold] wrote: As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.[/p][/quote]"....but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up" Perhaps they did look, and there was nothing to see! With nothing to report, no report was written! With no report to read, that may be why you've not read it! Mister E
  • Score: 4

11:58pm Fri 25 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

one in the crowd wrote:
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
No, the point is that the price that can still be achieved just by being in the premier league is massive, never mind the players. Thing parachute funds, tv money, etc...
[quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.[/p][/quote]No, the point is that the price that can still be achieved just by being in the premier league is massive, never mind the players. Thing parachute funds, tv money, etc... BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 6

11:58pm Fri 25 Jul 14

Blue means Success says...

one in the crowd wrote:
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
This is what you get with the sugar daddy model - If you aint a big club. 4 players to one club - incredible
[quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.[/p][/quote]This is what you get with the sugar daddy model - If you aint a big club. 4 players to one club - incredible Blue means Success
  • Score: 58

11:59pm Fri 25 Jul 14

one in the crowd says...

If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark.

One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons.

It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge.
If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark. One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons. It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge. one in the crowd
  • Score: 25

12:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

Crispinmumbles says...

I have been unswervingley loyal to the club and maintained an optimistic outlook during all the recent exodus. This however would be the straw that breaks this camels back. If Chambers goes then let's pick up our jumpers and go home for Tea.
ENOUGH!
I have been unswervingley loyal to the club and maintained an optimistic outlook during all the recent exodus. This however would be the straw that breaks this camels back. If Chambers goes then let's pick up our jumpers and go home for Tea. ENOUGH! Crispinmumbles
  • Score: 38

12:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

one in the crowd wrote:
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd?
[quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.[/p][/quote]Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd? Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 4

12:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

KiwiSaint74 says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
Someone over in Southampton needs to arrange a protest!
Time for a good old lynching? lol
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: Someone over in Southampton needs to arrange a protest![/p][/quote]Time for a good old lynching? lol KiwiSaint74
  • Score: 7

12:03am Sat 26 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

costa gaz wrote:
OSPREYSAINT wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............



. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes.
Nor mine, but I took a lot of flack from you and many others because of what I believed this was happening.
I expect you have broad shoulders, probably have to take a bit more as it is easy to knock others, when you can't knock the Club. Best moderate the negatives, some of us are getting a bit tetchie!
Chin up, it can only get worse, before it can get better, if in fact it ever does...............
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]None of this is actually my fault though I am a victim here not the cause of your woes.[/p][/quote]Nor mine, but I took a lot of flack from you and many others because of what I believed this was happening.[/p][/quote]I expect you have broad shoulders, probably have to take a bit more as it is easy to knock others, when you can't knock the Club. Best moderate the negatives, some of us are getting a bit tetchie! Chin up, it can only get worse, before it can get better, if in fact it ever does............... OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 4

12:04am Sat 26 Jul 14

bornandbread says...

This makes things very clear. We are either a selling club or one with ambition. My feeling is this is a step too far which says we are about making money for the board. Only one thing now will salvage the situation. Spend enormous, huge, obscene, obnoxious amounts of cash on players to show there is a purpose to this fire sale. If we don't spend now we know the answer. Someone is getting very rich at our expense. I'm not paying them for that so they'll get no money from me until I believe the money is for players, not profit.
This makes things very clear. We are either a selling club or one with ambition. My feeling is this is a step too far which says we are about making money for the board. Only one thing now will salvage the situation. Spend enormous, huge, obscene, obnoxious amounts of cash on players to show there is a purpose to this fire sale. If we don't spend now we know the answer. Someone is getting very rich at our expense. I'm not paying them for that so they'll get no money from me until I believe the money is for players, not profit. bornandbread
  • Score: 28

12:06am Sat 26 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

costa gaz wrote:
OSPREYSAINT wrote:
vidman wrote:
I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down.
Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens
If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more.
Have you been drinking?
Guilty as charged, but only in moderation, thought I should celebrate our win, didn't expect another kick in the nadgers though.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]vidman[/bold] wrote: I said a few months back that 6-8 players would be going, I was shot down. I said Les Reed had 'history', I was shot down. I said KL was banking the sale money prior to selling, I was shot down. Let me tell you why Reed says YES to any offer, he gets a percentage. KL wants a £100m and then she will sell. This is why we are making silly offers for players. Caulker turned us down as he did not like what he heard from the club. Foster and Vrij both say they want to come but neither has spoken to Reed. Let us see what happens[/p][/quote]If you knew it was going to happen why did you not do something about it? Talking about isn't enough, you should have done more.[/p][/quote]Have you been drinking?[/p][/quote]Guilty as charged, but only in moderation, thought I should celebrate our win, didn't expect another kick in the nadgers though. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 9

12:06am Sat 26 Jul 14

Saintsincethe60s says...

insider1234 wrote:
Can't we say no?
We can but we wont
[quote][p][bold]insider1234[/bold] wrote: Can't we say no?[/p][/quote]We can but we wont Saintsincethe60s
  • Score: 12

12:07am Sat 26 Jul 14

Tony in Liberia says...

FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid. Tony in Liberia
  • Score: 294

12:08am Sat 26 Jul 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

steekeemcglue wrote:
if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.
Well, I'll be the first to admitting that I'll be one of those idiots, just as I was an idiot to watch a far worse Saints team in League 1 and for several seasons either side of L1 when we were in the Championship.

But this isn't about the fans, and it's not really about the players or the Board or owner, it's much bigger than that; it's about the very heart of football - all across the World. Ask, say, Steaua Bucherest, Dortmund or Athletico fans, who regularly see their squads develop and do well and then watch as they're ripped apart by the vultures at the rich end of football.

Somehow, at the end of last season, we got away with it. NC sold the dream to the players, they bought into it for an extra season and we avoided the usual 'second season syndrome' that so many other newly promoted teams suffer, in which the best players feel they've taken a club as far as they can and they want to advance their careers at a so-called bigger club. It's now come back and kicked us in the teeth and, while the board has had options as to whether or not to sell each player and IMO haven't always acted or spoken wisely, in the end, they have to balance the price of selling a player now against what will be gained if they get one, two or, say, 15 seasons out of a player and then lose value on a future sale. (It was the same for NC when he sold Oxo for what he felt was the best price he could get at the time or at any future time.)

In short, we're victims of our own success and, in this sense, we're not the first, nor will we be the last.

Meanwhile, let's not forget that, as long as the money is invested in new players, just as with Pelle and Tadic, we'll be busy plundering clubs lower down football's evolutionary scale.

On a slightly different point, as P4thStreet says above, what is a bit weird is how accurately the MotD crowd read things. Was it just that they'd seen this happen before elsewhere? Was it that they made 2 +2 = 4 :- NC has gone = mass exodus? Or has there been something going on in the footballing world that none of us know about but which those on the inside do? Hard to say but weird nonetheless.

The clue as to whether or not enough really IS enough will be in what happens to the funds created (is anyone keeping count?). To date, the board hasn't done too well, but let's see what happens in the following couple of weeks or so. If some of the signings being mentioned come to pass, our squad could be truely amazing - alas, not as English or home-grown, though, because, by the start of this season, a number of those who improved at our club (and I include players like Rickie as well as the academy grads) will be warming a bench somewhere new.
[quote][p][bold]steekeemcglue[/bold] wrote: if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.[/p][/quote]Well, I'll be the first to admitting that I'll be one of those idiots, just as I was an idiot to watch a far worse Saints team in League 1 and for several seasons either side of L1 when we were in the Championship. But this isn't about the fans, and it's not really about the players or the Board or owner, it's much bigger than that; it's about the very heart of football - all across the World. Ask, say, Steaua Bucherest, Dortmund or Athletico fans, who regularly see their squads develop and do well and then watch as they're ripped apart by the vultures at the rich end of football. Somehow, at the end of last season, we got away with it. NC sold the dream to the players, they bought into it for an extra season and we avoided the usual 'second season syndrome' that so many other newly promoted teams suffer, in which the best players feel they've taken a club as far as they can and they want to advance their careers at a so-called bigger club. It's now come back and kicked us in the teeth and, while the board has had options as to whether or not to sell each player and IMO haven't always acted or spoken wisely, in the end, they have to balance the price of selling a player now against what will be gained if they get one, two or, say, 15 seasons out of a player and then lose value on a future sale. (It was the same for NC when he sold Oxo for what he felt was the best price he could get at the time or at any future time.) In short, we're victims of our own success and, in this sense, we're not the first, nor will we be the last. Meanwhile, let's not forget that, as long as the money is invested in new players, just as with Pelle and Tadic, we'll be busy plundering clubs lower down football's evolutionary scale. On a slightly different point, as P4thStreet says above, what is a bit weird is how accurately the MotD crowd read things. Was it just that they'd seen this happen before elsewhere? Was it that they made 2 +2 = 4 :- NC has gone = mass exodus? Or has there been something going on in the footballing world that none of us know about but which those on the inside do? Hard to say but weird nonetheless. The clue as to whether or not enough really IS enough will be in what happens to the funds created (is anyone keeping count?). To date, the board hasn't done too well, but let's see what happens in the following couple of weeks or so. If some of the signings being mentioned come to pass, our squad could be truely amazing - alas, not as English or home-grown, though, because, by the start of this season, a number of those who improved at our club (and I include players like Rickie as well as the academy grads) will be warming a bench somewhere new. Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 35

12:08am Sat 26 Jul 14

tarquin farquharson says...

Les Reed. One of the greatest non-entities of English football ever. Check out this man's record. Failure intermingled with a basic grasp of administration. And he's finished his glorious non-career overseeing the destruction of our club.
Les Reed. One of the greatest non-entities of English football ever. Check out this man's record. Failure intermingled with a basic grasp of administration. And he's finished his glorious non-career overseeing the destruction of our club. tarquin farquharson
  • Score: 19

12:08am Sat 26 Jul 14

mr miyagi says...

OK. Throughout this whole sorry episode, I have not commented about the comings and goings (mainly goings) at Saints, but enough is enough. Now Arsenal are closing in on Calum Chambers for a reported £16m. This is a player with limited first team experience for £16m! What the f*ck is going on. With Lambert, Llanana & Lovren to Liverpool, Shaw to Man U, Chambers to Arsenal and possibly Schneiderlin to Arsenal or Spurs. Also Clyne, Rodriguez and Fonte have been mentioned as possible departures, that would make up to 9 players leaving, with arguably 8 of them as first team players.

How can the board of a club that finished 8th last season allow this to happen, when they should be building on that success. In all my years I have never witnessed such a potential demolition of a club. I firmly blame Ralph Kruger and Les Reed, as I see them as the sole decision makers in this process, particularly for coming out and stating there would not be a fire sale and no star players will be sold. Liars.

I know if a player wants to leave, you will struggle to stop that, but could they not be sold a vision that they must have been sold by the previous regime. No disrespect to Villa, who have struggled for the last two or three seasons, but they say hands off and thats that, end of story. We say hands off and the next thing we know the player has been sold.

We will run out of time to buy any suitable replacements, if any, and start the season fielding a young inexperienced team, like Villa did, and take some beatings. On top of that, how can we expect to attract any big players in, the first question they will ask is 'Why is everyone leaving? Thanks but no thanks'. Pelle and Tadic probably only signed because they knew the boss, but that stream will dry up pretty quickly, or do we become Feyanoord on the coast? Season starts in three weeks, but our last signing was two weeks ago, apart from the young goalie from Torquay.

I am really fearful of next season, particularly if the kids get thrown in. I think it will have a detrimental impact on the Academy, but really hope it don't come to that.
OK. Throughout this whole sorry episode, I have not commented about the comings and goings (mainly goings) at Saints, but enough is enough. Now Arsenal are closing in on Calum Chambers for a reported £16m. This is a player with limited first team experience for £16m! What the f*ck is going on. With Lambert, Llanana & Lovren to Liverpool, Shaw to Man U, Chambers to Arsenal and possibly Schneiderlin to Arsenal or Spurs. Also Clyne, Rodriguez and Fonte have been mentioned as possible departures, that would make up to 9 players leaving, with arguably 8 of them as first team players. How can the board of a club that finished 8th last season allow this to happen, when they should be building on that success. In all my years I have never witnessed such a potential demolition of a club. I firmly blame Ralph Kruger and Les Reed, as I see them as the sole decision makers in this process, particularly for coming out and stating there would not be a fire sale and no star players will be sold. Liars. I know if a player wants to leave, you will struggle to stop that, but could they not be sold a vision that they must have been sold by the previous regime. No disrespect to Villa, who have struggled for the last two or three seasons, but they say hands off and thats that, end of story. We say hands off and the next thing we know the player has been sold. We will run out of time to buy any suitable replacements, if any, and start the season fielding a young inexperienced team, like Villa did, and take some beatings. On top of that, how can we expect to attract any big players in, the first question they will ask is 'Why is everyone leaving? Thanks but no thanks'. Pelle and Tadic probably only signed because they knew the boss, but that stream will dry up pretty quickly, or do we become Feyanoord on the coast? Season starts in three weeks, but our last signing was two weeks ago, apart from the young goalie from Torquay. I am really fearful of next season, particularly if the kids get thrown in. I think it will have a detrimental impact on the Academy, but really hope it don't come to that. mr miyagi
  • Score: 22

12:09am Sat 26 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

costa gaz wrote:
OSPREYSAINT wrote:
03alpe01 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"
Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.
Just about sums you up. Good grief
The fact that none of the stripey shirts ever fit is neither hear nor there, I never buy them anyhow.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.[/p][/quote]I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"[/p][/quote]Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.[/p][/quote]Just about sums you up. Good grief[/p][/quote]The fact that none of the stripey shirts ever fit is neither hear nor there, I never buy them anyhow. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

12:10am Sat 26 Jul 14

KiwiSaint74 says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Wicked mate, intense!
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Wicked mate, intense! KiwiSaint74
  • Score: 32

12:10am Sat 26 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

tarquin farquharson wrote:
Les Reed. One of the greatest non-entities of English football ever. Check out this man's record. Failure intermingled with a basic grasp of administration. And he's finished his glorious non-career overseeing the destruction of our club.
He means well.
[quote][p][bold]tarquin farquharson[/bold] wrote: Les Reed. One of the greatest non-entities of English football ever. Check out this man's record. Failure intermingled with a basic grasp of administration. And he's finished his glorious non-career overseeing the destruction of our club.[/p][/quote]He means well. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: -7

12:12am Sat 26 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view. costa gaz
  • Score: 27

12:12am Sat 26 Jul 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Hey, let's sleep on it, we will all feel better in the morning.............
...
Hey, let's sleep on it, we will all feel better in the morning............. ... OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

12:15am Sat 26 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
Hey, let's sleep on it, we will all feel better in the morning.............

...
I'm not tired now. ;0)
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: Hey, let's sleep on it, we will all feel better in the morning............. ...[/p][/quote]I'm not tired now. ;0) Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 4

12:15am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
I don't think I ever said there would be no exodus. I have only ever said that I wouldn't speculate.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]I don't think I ever said there would be no exodus. I have only ever said that I wouldn't speculate. Rising_Son
  • Score: 0

12:20am Sat 26 Jul 14

tarquin farquharson says...

saintmac wrote:
The OS says Lovren is sick. Who now believes anything the Board says?
It is obvious Chambers has been in London. For pitys sake,KL, sell theClub to somebody who may possibly care. We have an inept Board and an owner who may initially have been interested but now just wants to sell up and make a profit.All that talk about tears in her eyes when talking about her Fathers connections with the Club and how she wanted to bring a smile to the fans faces appear to be just that - all talk. The fans have certainly got tears in their eyes. THE FANS HAVE BEEN CONNED. Its Mr Koeman I feel sorry for as he will be blamed if we are
relegated and this is now more than likely.
You think Koeman is any different? We are a stepping stone for him, he now has his toe in the door of the premier league and he will have his sights on managing a top team in this league one day . That is why he is prepared to put up with this sh*t. It's a trade off.
[quote][p][bold]saintmac[/bold] wrote: The OS says Lovren is sick. Who now believes anything the Board says? It is obvious Chambers has been in London. For pitys sake,KL, sell theClub to somebody who may possibly care. We have an inept Board and an owner who may initially have been interested but now just wants to sell up and make a profit.All that talk about tears in her eyes when talking about her Fathers connections with the Club and how she wanted to bring a smile to the fans faces appear to be just that - all talk. The fans have certainly got tears in their eyes. THE FANS HAVE BEEN CONNED. Its Mr Koeman I feel sorry for as he will be blamed if we are relegated and this is now more than likely.[/p][/quote]You think Koeman is any different? We are a stepping stone for him, he now has his toe in the door of the premier league and he will have his sights on managing a top team in this league one day . That is why he is prepared to put up with this sh*t. It's a trade off. tarquin farquharson
  • Score: 14

12:20am Sat 26 Jul 14

saintmac says...

The Echo, Radio Solent and South Today should be hammering on the doors of SFC asking a lot of hard questions and demanding answers that are truthful.
The Echo, Radio Solent and South Today should be hammering on the doors of SFC asking a lot of hard questions and demanding answers that are truthful. saintmac
  • Score: 38

12:22am Sat 26 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

KiwiSaint74 wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Wicked mate, intense!
Yes I agree,that was a very good post.If that is somewhere near the truth,then it blows the conspiracy theory clean out of the water,but the board haven't helped themselves in that respect by saying one thing,and then doing exactly the opposite,and then remaining tight lipped about it all.
[quote][p][bold]KiwiSaint74[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Wicked mate, intense![/p][/quote]Yes I agree,that was a very good post.If that is somewhere near the truth,then it blows the conspiracy theory clean out of the water,but the board haven't helped themselves in that respect by saying one thing,and then doing exactly the opposite,and then remaining tight lipped about it all. Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 34

12:23am Sat 26 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
OSPREYSAINT wrote:
03alpe01 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
SaintSteve76 wrote:
Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out!
Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.
I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"
Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.
Just about sums you up. Good grief
The fact that none of the stripey shirts ever fit is neither hear nor there, I never buy them anyhow.
Go to bed Osprey.
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]SaintSteve76[/bold] wrote: Anyone who is still positive now is deluded and needs to wake up. End of. Board out![/p][/quote]Time has come for the deluded few to join the merchants of doom and let the club know what they think... you can't keep hiding from the truth boys.[/p][/quote]I'm waiting for the usual morons to say "Don't worry, at least we have the stripes back"[/p][/quote]Don't worry at least we have the stripes back.[/p][/quote]Just about sums you up. Good grief[/p][/quote]The fact that none of the stripey shirts ever fit is neither hear nor there, I never buy them anyhow.[/p][/quote]Go to bed Osprey. costa gaz
  • Score: 2

12:25am Sat 26 Jul 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Says most of what I said - and more - but better. Well put Tony - once again.

(Just a slight thing about Le Tiss, though, he DID have a chance to sign for Spuds but, according to what others have reported that he said, he didn't sign ONLY because his wife wanted him to stay at Saints.)
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Says most of what I said - and more - but better. Well put Tony - once again. (Just a slight thing about Le Tiss, though, he DID have a chance to sign for Spuds but, according to what others have reported that he said, he didn't sign ONLY because his wife wanted him to stay at Saints.) Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 6

12:26am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
It would be interesting to know who doesn't agree.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]It would be interesting to know who doesn't agree. Rising_Son
  • Score: 16

12:26am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions? BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: -7

12:27am Sat 26 Jul 14

one in the crowd says...

Positively4thStreet wrote:
one in the crowd wrote:
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd?
I may not be a Saint's supporter , but by the same token I realised what was happening weeks ago and started contributing on this posting when I felt Liverpool FC was being unfairly treated as the culprit to all the ills being suffered by Saints.

Despite being a Liverpool fan, I do not wish to see Saint's lose their place in the PL, I wouldn't wish that on anybody. Saint's is a very fine FC and is held in high esteem by other Premier League clubs and genuine football fans .

The fact of the matter is that so many of your players want out. The only explanation I feel that justifies this attitude is that they know something that seriously affects their future career prospects at Saint's and the club's owners apparent lack of ambition. I don't think money is necessarily the major reason completely.
[quote][p][bold]Positively4thStreet[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.[/p][/quote]Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd?[/p][/quote]I may not be a Saint's supporter , but by the same token I realised what was happening weeks ago and started contributing on this posting when I felt Liverpool FC was being unfairly treated as the culprit to all the ills being suffered by Saints. Despite being a Liverpool fan, I do not wish to see Saint's lose their place in the PL, I wouldn't wish that on anybody. Saint's is a very fine FC and is held in high esteem by other Premier League clubs and genuine football fans . The fact of the matter is that so many of your players want out. The only explanation I feel that justifies this attitude is that they know something that seriously affects their future career prospects at Saint's and the club's owners apparent lack of ambition. I don't think money is necessarily the major reason completely. one in the crowd
  • Score: 14

12:29am Sat 26 Jul 14

Positively4thStreet says...

one in the crowd wrote:
Positively4thStreet wrote:
one in the crowd wrote:
Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ?

SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014

PHASE 1

Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible.

The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club.


PHASE 2

Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League.

Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.
Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd?
I may not be a Saint's supporter , but by the same token I realised what was happening weeks ago and started contributing on this posting when I felt Liverpool FC was being unfairly treated as the culprit to all the ills being suffered by Saints.

Despite being a Liverpool fan, I do not wish to see Saint's lose their place in the PL, I wouldn't wish that on anybody. Saint's is a very fine FC and is held in high esteem by other Premier League clubs and genuine football fans .

The fact of the matter is that so many of your players want out. The only explanation I feel that justifies this attitude is that they know something that seriously affects their future career prospects at Saint's and the club's owners apparent lack of ambition. I don't think money is necessarily the major reason completely.
You come on here to gloat.
[quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Positively4thStreet[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: Now that Saint's are talking about selling yet another player, whe will all you Saint's fans wake-up to what is happening to your club ? SAINT'S BATTLE PLAN 2014 PHASE 1 Sell players to raise as much money as possible, replacing as many of them as one can as cheaply as possible. The owners of Saint's have now got back more than they have invested in the club. PHASE 2 Sell Saint's for the highest price that one can get whilst it is still in the Premier League. Having already harvested money from the sale of players ( any more player sales being an extra bonus ), the figure raised by selling the club isn't really important if one is quitting football club ownership.[/p][/quote]Is this really any of your business,Search for the Crowd?[/p][/quote]I may not be a Saint's supporter , but by the same token I realised what was happening weeks ago and started contributing on this posting when I felt Liverpool FC was being unfairly treated as the culprit to all the ills being suffered by Saints. Despite being a Liverpool fan, I do not wish to see Saint's lose their place in the PL, I wouldn't wish that on anybody. Saint's is a very fine FC and is held in high esteem by other Premier League clubs and genuine football fans . The fact of the matter is that so many of your players want out. The only explanation I feel that justifies this attitude is that they know something that seriously affects their future career prospects at Saint's and the club's owners apparent lack of ambition. I don't think money is necessarily the major reason completely.[/p][/quote]You come on here to gloat. Positively4thStreet
  • Score: 5

12:36am Sat 26 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

For the deluded who still think that the club has been honest with us, watch this one more time, see if you can get to the end without spitting at your screen. http://www.youtube.c
om/watch?v=SMyOMDhfo
8c

The bloke is clueless, i swear his nose was growing whilst I played the video.
For the deluded who still think that the club has been honest with us, watch this one more time, see if you can get to the end without spitting at your screen. http://www.youtube.c om/watch?v=SMyOMDhfo 8c The bloke is clueless, i swear his nose was growing whilst I played the video. costa gaz
  • Score: 11

12:44am Sat 26 Jul 14

Strasbourg Saint says...

Btw, everyone, Harrison Reed has signed a new four-year contract. There was a DE thread about it at 8.39pm this evening, so you probably missed it following the match, commenting on Lovren and Chambers and all that.

Harrison seems like a great young lad with a really good future. I would have imagined that every Saints fan would want to say how pleased they are for the club and the player right now, but oddly enough only 12 comments have so far been made - that's 3 per hour, whereas this one's on about 1 comment per minute. So here's your chance to wish Harrison all the best as he grows into a great Saint. It's a good news story, so go on, give it a go.
Btw, everyone, Harrison Reed has signed a new four-year contract. There was a DE thread about it at 8.39pm this evening, so you probably missed it following the match, commenting on Lovren and Chambers and all that. Harrison seems like a great young lad with a really good future. I would have imagined that every Saints fan would want to say how pleased they are for the club and the player right now, but oddly enough only 12 comments have so far been made - that's 3 per hour, whereas this one's on about 1 comment per minute. So here's your chance to wish Harrison all the best as he grows into a great Saint. It's a good news story, so go on, give it a go. Strasbourg Saint
  • Score: 20

12:45am Sat 26 Jul 14

NewForestStu says...

03alpe01 wrote:
There will not be a fire-sale here- Les Reed
Priceless wasn't it. I think i am getting to the point of being past caring now. Feel like i have been mugged of £600+ for my season ticket now.
[quote][p][bold]03alpe01[/bold] wrote: There will not be a fire-sale here- Les Reed[/p][/quote]Priceless wasn't it. I think i am getting to the point of being past caring now. Feel like i have been mugged of £600+ for my season ticket now. NewForestStu
  • Score: 12

12:47am Sat 26 Jul 14

THE12THMAN says...

If this is true it is an insult to every saints fan, the board have gone too far now, enough is enough.
If this is true it is an insult to every saints fan, the board have gone too far now, enough is enough. THE12THMAN
  • Score: 7

12:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

SaintSherman says...

Every player sold so far has been understandable, however to sell off Chambers would be nothing short of stupid especially if no replacements are in sight. However until I see this actually go through there is the chance it could just be rumors, well that's me being hopeful anyway.
Every player sold so far has been understandable, however to sell off Chambers would be nothing short of stupid especially if no replacements are in sight. However until I see this actually go through there is the chance it could just be rumors, well that's me being hopeful anyway. SaintSherman
  • Score: -2

12:56am Sat 26 Jul 14

Invidia says...

The next statement from the board probably when a few more of last seasons team have been sold off and don't believe for one moment that this has come to an end just yet, there is still five weeks left in this window the statement will be something about not keeping players who do not want to play for Southampton and we will replace those who have gone with better players (where they are going to get these better players from is any ones guess, maybe they will look at Real Madrid, Milan, Barca, Man utd. Man city Chelsea, Liverpool and arsenal). I give in.
The next statement from the board probably when a few more of last seasons team have been sold off and don't believe for one moment that this has come to an end just yet, there is still five weeks left in this window the statement will be something about not keeping players who do not want to play for Southampton and we will replace those who have gone with better players (where they are going to get these better players from is any ones guess, maybe they will look at Real Madrid, Milan, Barca, Man utd. Man city Chelsea, Liverpool and arsenal). I give in. Invidia
  • Score: 6

12:58am Sat 26 Jul 14

This is Southampton and we are the Saints says...

OSPREYSAINT wrote:
MccSaint wrote:
I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.
Mugged again, I think we deserve an explanation and a pledge for the future don't you? I've tried my best to defend the Club and they do this?
Even the happiest clapper in the World has to question what is happening?
OSPREYSAINT welcome to the dark side! We did try to tell you?
But you got there in the end!
Time to grab the pitch forks boys!
And head to St Mary's
Enough is Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!
[quote][p][bold]OSPREYSAINT[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]MccSaint[/bold] wrote: I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.[/p][/quote]Mugged again, I think we deserve an explanation and a pledge for the future don't you? I've tried my best to defend the Club and they do this? Even the happiest clapper in the World has to question what is happening?[/p][/quote]OSPREYSAINT welcome to the dark side! We did try to tell you? But you got there in the end! Time to grab the pitch forks boys! And head to St Mary's Enough is Enough!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!!!!!!!!!! This is Southampton and we are the Saints
  • Score: 11

1:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

Invidia says...

SaintSherman wrote:
Every player sold so far has been understandable, however to sell off Chambers would be nothing short of stupid especially if no replacements are in sight. However until I see this actually go through there is the chance it could just be rumors, well that's me being hopeful anyway.
That is very odd, of all the players and those about to be sold Chambers is the only one that does make sense he has been vying for the RB position with Clyne all season, and the only position that we had cover, very odd.
[quote][p][bold]SaintSherman[/bold] wrote: Every player sold so far has been understandable, however to sell off Chambers would be nothing short of stupid especially if no replacements are in sight. However until I see this actually go through there is the chance it could just be rumors, well that's me being hopeful anyway.[/p][/quote]That is very odd, of all the players and those about to be sold Chambers is the only one that does make sense he has been vying for the RB position with Clyne all season, and the only position that we had cover, very odd. Invidia
  • Score: 11

1:03am Sat 26 Jul 14

will2ksaints says...

Seriously getting pi55ed off now! Why are we selling out great prospects now. Becoming a joke! Les reed and ice hockey boy just lie about everything! So what if we have stripes back, need some players to actually wear them!
Seriously getting pi55ed off now! Why are we selling out great prospects now. Becoming a joke! Les reed and ice hockey boy just lie about everything! So what if we have stripes back, need some players to actually wear them! will2ksaints
  • Score: 11

1:11am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Strasbourg Saint wrote:
Btw, everyone, Harrison Reed has signed a new four-year contract. There was a DE thread about it at 8.39pm this evening, so you probably missed it following the match, commenting on Lovren and Chambers and all that.

Harrison seems like a great young lad with a really good future. I would have imagined that every Saints fan would want to say how pleased they are for the club and the player right now, but oddly enough only 12 comments have so far been made - that's 3 per hour, whereas this one's on about 1 comment per minute. So here's your chance to wish Harrison all the best as he grows into a great Saint. It's a good news story, so go on, give it a go.
Good try, but those statistics show how far out the situation is. You are right, we should be happy, but the situation makes that impossible.
[quote][p][bold]Strasbourg Saint[/bold] wrote: Btw, everyone, Harrison Reed has signed a new four-year contract. There was a DE thread about it at 8.39pm this evening, so you probably missed it following the match, commenting on Lovren and Chambers and all that. Harrison seems like a great young lad with a really good future. I would have imagined that every Saints fan would want to say how pleased they are for the club and the player right now, but oddly enough only 12 comments have so far been made - that's 3 per hour, whereas this one's on about 1 comment per minute. So here's your chance to wish Harrison all the best as he grows into a great Saint. It's a good news story, so go on, give it a go.[/p][/quote]Good try, but those statistics show how far out the situation is. You are right, we should be happy, but the situation makes that impossible. BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 0

1:12am Sat 26 Jul 14

Tony in Liberia says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ... Tony in Liberia
  • Score: 1

1:13am Sat 26 Jul 14

poshdave says...

.............this is a p***take............
.....we are fast becoming one of the biggest jokes in EPL history.......I've tried to support those in charge, but this is an unprecedented clear out of a team, so there must be something really f**ked up in club, teams just don't disintegrate like this, in any league, .............and more worryingly , they don't seem to be kicking down the door to come play for us!.......getting very tough to be positive............
.............this is a p***take............ .....we are fast becoming one of the biggest jokes in EPL history.......I've tried to support those in charge, but this is an unprecedented clear out of a team, so there must be something really f**ked up in club, teams just don't disintegrate like this, in any league, .............and more worryingly , they don't seem to be kicking down the door to come play for us!.......getting very tough to be positive............ poshdave
  • Score: 7

1:15am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Strasbourg Saint wrote:
steekeemcglue wrote:
if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.
Well, I'll be the first to admitting that I'll be one of those idiots, just as I was an idiot to watch a far worse Saints team in League 1 and for several seasons either side of L1 when we were in the Championship.

But this isn't about the fans, and it's not really about the players or the Board or owner, it's much bigger than that; it's about the very heart of football - all across the World. Ask, say, Steaua Bucherest, Dortmund or Athletico fans, who regularly see their squads develop and do well and then watch as they're ripped apart by the vultures at the rich end of football.

Somehow, at the end of last season, we got away with it. NC sold the dream to the players, they bought into it for an extra season and we avoided the usual 'second season syndrome' that so many other newly promoted teams suffer, in which the best players feel they've taken a club as far as they can and they want to advance their careers at a so-called bigger club. It's now come back and kicked us in the teeth and, while the board has had options as to whether or not to sell each player and IMO haven't always acted or spoken wisely, in the end, they have to balance the price of selling a player now against what will be gained if they get one, two or, say, 15 seasons out of a player and then lose value on a future sale. (It was the same for NC when he sold Oxo for what he felt was the best price he could get at the time or at any future time.)

In short, we're victims of our own success and, in this sense, we're not the first, nor will we be the last.

Meanwhile, let's not forget that, as long as the money is invested in new players, just as with Pelle and Tadic, we'll be busy plundering clubs lower down football's evolutionary scale.

On a slightly different point, as P4thStreet says above, what is a bit weird is how accurately the MotD crowd read things. Was it just that they'd seen this happen before elsewhere? Was it that they made 2 +2 = 4 :- NC has gone = mass exodus? Or has there been something going on in the footballing world that none of us know about but which those on the inside do? Hard to say but weird nonetheless.

The clue as to whether or not enough really IS enough will be in what happens to the funds created (is anyone keeping count?). To date, the board hasn't done too well, but let's see what happens in the following couple of weeks or so. If some of the signings being mentioned come to pass, our squad could be truely amazing - alas, not as English or home-grown, though, because, by the start of this season, a number of those who improved at our club (and I include players like Rickie as well as the academy grads) will be warming a bench somewhere new.
You are right, if the signings like de Vriij, Forster, Clasie,p etc come through, I will eat my words, but I am willing to bet they won't, not for us anyway...
[quote][p][bold]Strasbourg Saint[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]steekeemcglue[/bold] wrote: if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.[/p][/quote]Well, I'll be the first to admitting that I'll be one of those idiots, just as I was an idiot to watch a far worse Saints team in League 1 and for several seasons either side of L1 when we were in the Championship. But this isn't about the fans, and it's not really about the players or the Board or owner, it's much bigger than that; it's about the very heart of football - all across the World. Ask, say, Steaua Bucherest, Dortmund or Athletico fans, who regularly see their squads develop and do well and then watch as they're ripped apart by the vultures at the rich end of football. Somehow, at the end of last season, we got away with it. NC sold the dream to the players, they bought into it for an extra season and we avoided the usual 'second season syndrome' that so many other newly promoted teams suffer, in which the best players feel they've taken a club as far as they can and they want to advance their careers at a so-called bigger club. It's now come back and kicked us in the teeth and, while the board has had options as to whether or not to sell each player and IMO haven't always acted or spoken wisely, in the end, they have to balance the price of selling a player now against what will be gained if they get one, two or, say, 15 seasons out of a player and then lose value on a future sale. (It was the same for NC when he sold Oxo for what he felt was the best price he could get at the time or at any future time.) In short, we're victims of our own success and, in this sense, we're not the first, nor will we be the last. Meanwhile, let's not forget that, as long as the money is invested in new players, just as with Pelle and Tadic, we'll be busy plundering clubs lower down football's evolutionary scale. On a slightly different point, as P4thStreet says above, what is a bit weird is how accurately the MotD crowd read things. Was it just that they'd seen this happen before elsewhere? Was it that they made 2 +2 = 4 :- NC has gone = mass exodus? Or has there been something going on in the footballing world that none of us know about but which those on the inside do? Hard to say but weird nonetheless. The clue as to whether or not enough really IS enough will be in what happens to the funds created (is anyone keeping count?). To date, the board hasn't done too well, but let's see what happens in the following couple of weeks or so. If some of the signings being mentioned come to pass, our squad could be truely amazing - alas, not as English or home-grown, though, because, by the start of this season, a number of those who improved at our club (and I include players like Rickie as well as the academy grads) will be warming a bench somewhere new.[/p][/quote]You are right, if the signings like de Vriij, Forster, Clasie,p etc come through, I will eat my words, but I am willing to bet they won't, not for us anyway... BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 6

1:17am Sat 26 Jul 14

de Heiligen paard 101 says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
gaz,
I`m as upset about this news as I have been about every other player leaving, except Osvaldo and rickie to an extent. I don't like whats happened this summer, I don't know why you think I/we are all happy!

the difference between you and me is that I`m not delighted by all this news, to the extent were I come on here and rub peoples noses in it and proclaim what a genius am for seeing it all along!
you cant wait to mention myself and others in posts and accuse us of gleefully encouraging the board to do this!

unlike you I don't see this as the fault of the board, I see this as the fault of weak minded players who see a big pay packet and the chance to play in the champs league, without even earning it.

I know your going to say `5th lowest wage in the league` youve said it enough! so what do you want the club to do? just as arsenil had to cut back and lose some of their best players because of building their new stadium, we haven't been able to offer higher wages because we spent £30mill on an already good training ground. that's £30mill that could have gone on wages, or £around £3mill a week over 2yrs . even if it was the £15mill that it should have been that is still £1.4ishmill a week over 2 years. to put it another way that would be 14 100k a week players. don't get me wrong it wouldn't have all gone on wages but it just might be a reason why our wages were/are low. now its built we might see an increase in the wage structure. however there is nothing the new board could have done about that as the training ground was already being built and the wages were sorted out by the mystical hero NC, there have only been a few contracts sorted out since he threw his toys from the pram.

as I say I am far from happy but I don't go around throwing abuse at the board or the owner, how anyone can call her a fat b.... is unbelievable, and they should be ashamed of themselves!
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]gaz, I`m as upset about this news as I have been about every other player leaving, except Osvaldo and rickie to an extent. I don't like whats happened this summer, I don't know why you think I/we are all happy! the difference between you and me is that I`m not delighted by all this news, to the extent were I come on here and rub peoples noses in it and proclaim what a genius am for seeing it all along! you cant wait to mention myself and others in posts and accuse us of gleefully encouraging the board to do this! unlike you I don't see this as the fault of the board, I see this as the fault of weak minded players who see a big pay packet and the chance to play in the champs league, without even earning it. I know your going to say `5th lowest wage in the league` youve said it enough! so what do you want the club to do? just as arsenil had to cut back and lose some of their best players because of building their new stadium, we haven't been able to offer higher wages because we spent £30mill on an already good training ground. that's £30mill that could have gone on wages, or £around £3mill a week over 2yrs . even if it was the £15mill that it should have been that is still £1.4ishmill a week over 2 years. to put it another way that would be 14 100k a week players. don't get me wrong it wouldn't have all gone on wages but it just might be a reason why our wages were/are low. now its built we might see an increase in the wage structure. however there is nothing the new board could have done about that as the training ground was already being built and the wages were sorted out by the mystical hero NC, there have only been a few contracts sorted out since he threw his toys from the pram. as I say I am far from happy but I don't go around throwing abuse at the board or the owner, how anyone can call her a fat b.... is unbelievable, and they should be ashamed of themselves! de Heiligen paard 101
  • Score: 27

1:17am Sat 26 Jul 14

de Heiligen paard 101 says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
gaz,
I`m as upset about this news as I have been about every other player leaving, except Osvaldo and rickie to an extent. I don't like whats happened this summer, I don't know why you think I/we are all happy!

the difference between you and me is that I`m not delighted by all this news, to the extent were I come on here and rub peoples noses in it and proclaim what a genius am for seeing it all along!
you cant wait to mention myself and others in posts and accuse us of gleefully encouraging the board to do this!

unlike you I don't see this as the fault of the board, I see this as the fault of weak minded players who see a big pay packet and the chance to play in the champs league, without even earning it.

I know your going to say `5th lowest wage in the league` youve said it enough! so what do you want the club to do? just as arsenil had to cut back and lose some of their best players because of building their new stadium, we haven't been able to offer higher wages because we spent £30mill on an already good training ground. that's £30mill that could have gone on wages, or £around £3mill a week over 2yrs . even if it was the £15mill that it should have been that is still £1.4ishmill a week over 2 years. to put it another way that would be 14 100k a week players. don't get me wrong it wouldn't have all gone on wages but it just might be a reason why our wages were/are low. now its built we might see an increase in the wage structure. however there is nothing the new board could have done about that as the training ground was already being built and the wages were sorted out by the mystical hero NC, there have only been a few contracts sorted out since he threw his toys from the pram.

as I say I am far from happy but I don't go around throwing abuse at the board or the owner, how anyone can call her a fat b.... is unbelievable, and they should be ashamed of themselves!
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]gaz, I`m as upset about this news as I have been about every other player leaving, except Osvaldo and rickie to an extent. I don't like whats happened this summer, I don't know why you think I/we are all happy! the difference between you and me is that I`m not delighted by all this news, to the extent were I come on here and rub peoples noses in it and proclaim what a genius am for seeing it all along! you cant wait to mention myself and others in posts and accuse us of gleefully encouraging the board to do this! unlike you I don't see this as the fault of the board, I see this as the fault of weak minded players who see a big pay packet and the chance to play in the champs league, without even earning it. I know your going to say `5th lowest wage in the league` youve said it enough! so what do you want the club to do? just as arsenil had to cut back and lose some of their best players because of building their new stadium, we haven't been able to offer higher wages because we spent £30mill on an already good training ground. that's £30mill that could have gone on wages, or £around £3mill a week over 2yrs . even if it was the £15mill that it should have been that is still £1.4ishmill a week over 2 years. to put it another way that would be 14 100k a week players. don't get me wrong it wouldn't have all gone on wages but it just might be a reason why our wages were/are low. now its built we might see an increase in the wage structure. however there is nothing the new board could have done about that as the training ground was already being built and the wages were sorted out by the mystical hero NC, there have only been a few contracts sorted out since he threw his toys from the pram. as I say I am far from happy but I don't go around throwing abuse at the board or the owner, how anyone can call her a fat b.... is unbelievable, and they should be ashamed of themselves! de Heiligen paard 101
  • Score: 2

1:27am Sat 26 Jul 14

poshdave says...

.............this is a p***take............
.....we are fast becoming one of the biggest jokes in EPL history.......I've tried to support those in charge, but this is an unprecedented clear out of a team, so there must be something really f**ked up in club, teams just don't disintegrate like this, in any league, .............and more worryingly , they don't seem to be kicking down the door to come play for us!.......getting very tough to be positive............
.............this is a p***take............ .....we are fast becoming one of the biggest jokes in EPL history.......I've tried to support those in charge, but this is an unprecedented clear out of a team, so there must be something really f**ked up in club, teams just don't disintegrate like this, in any league, .............and more worryingly , they don't seem to be kicking down the door to come play for us!.......getting very tough to be positive............ poshdave
  • Score: 3

1:28am Sat 26 Jul 14

KiwiSaint74 says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...
I wouldn't hold my breath either. Why would the government get involved? However I would never doubt the weight of public opinion. In this case i'm not sure how much clout it has though. The board have indeed carried out a 180 degree turn with regards to not selling any more players. I myself don't see the logic in how this sale would improve the club, and the fact that the board remain tight lipped throughout this process does worry me.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...[/p][/quote]I wouldn't hold my breath either. Why would the government get involved? However I would never doubt the weight of public opinion. In this case i'm not sure how much clout it has though. The board have indeed carried out a 180 degree turn with regards to not selling any more players. I myself don't see the logic in how this sale would improve the club, and the fact that the board remain tight lipped throughout this process does worry me. KiwiSaint74
  • Score: 3

1:40am Sat 26 Jul 14

de Heiligen paard 101 says...

Wow -7 in less than 20mins thats some record for the WUMs to beat.
Why don't you try it with this post?
I will help you out a bit by saying that you are all numptys of the highest class!
Right its 1:40am ready set go!
Wow -7 in less than 20mins thats some record for the WUMs to beat. Why don't you try it with this post? I will help you out a bit by saying that you are all numptys of the highest class! Right its 1:40am ready set go! de Heiligen paard 101
  • Score: 8

1:49am Sat 26 Jul 14

Supersaint90 says...

I've had enough of this!!! F**k it, sell the whole team and let's start again!! BRING BACK CORTESE :(
I've had enough of this!!! F**k it, sell the whole team and let's start again!! BRING BACK CORTESE :( Supersaint90
  • Score: 4

1:55am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick.
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick. Rising_Son
  • Score: 4

2:00am Sat 26 Jul 14

saints1998 says...

I want a refund for my season ticket.
I want a refund for my season ticket. saints1998
  • Score: 11

2:00am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

And there wouldn't be a buyer.
And there wouldn't be a buyer. Rising_Son
  • Score: 10

2:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

olddellsaint says...

It's about time we start buying, '9' gone, '2' in, can't be anybody left to start the new season, ???, come on Saints, start to give us Saints fans some confidence in this new team please.
It's about time we start buying, '9' gone, '2' in, can't be anybody left to start the new season, ???, come on Saints, start to give us Saints fans some confidence in this new team please. olddellsaint
  • Score: 10

2:10am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Rising_Son wrote:
BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick.
Not sure. I don't think fans would have objected to every sale that has happened. I also happen to think that a club where fans have a democratically unearthed position on important matters, would be an exceptionally fun club to follow. In other words, revenues may benefit positively. I think fans truly want what is best for the long term future of the club. Any owner with that horizon, and who trusts the knowledge of fans, should not be frightened off.
[quote][p][bold]Rising_Son[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick.[/p][/quote]Not sure. I don't think fans would have objected to every sale that has happened. I also happen to think that a club where fans have a democratically unearthed position on important matters, would be an exceptionally fun club to follow. In other words, revenues may benefit positively. I think fans truly want what is best for the long term future of the club. Any owner with that horizon, and who trusts the knowledge of fans, should not be frightened off. BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 2

2:13am Sat 26 Jul 14

de Heiligen paard 101 says...

saints1998 wrote:
I want a refund for my season ticket.
Well ring up the club and ask then! Go on give it a try see what they say.

I don't think you will get very far as season tickets are brought to watch Southampton football club, they don't say which players have to be in the squad/team.

You should have had a word with Costa Gaz before you brought it, he saw this all coming a long time ago and he might have told you about it.

So if you ring and get your refund tomorrow and then next week we sign 5 really good players will you want your ticket back?
[quote][p][bold]saints1998[/bold] wrote: I want a refund for my season ticket.[/p][/quote]Well ring up the club and ask then! Go on give it a try see what they say. I don't think you will get very far as season tickets are brought to watch Southampton football club, they don't say which players have to be in the squad/team. You should have had a word with Costa Gaz before you brought it, he saw this all coming a long time ago and he might have told you about it. So if you ring and get your refund tomorrow and then next week we sign 5 really good players will you want your ticket back? de Heiligen paard 101
  • Score: 1

2:29am Sat 26 Jul 14

Tony in Liberia says...

It doesn't matter how much power the fans have got; do you really think that would have stopped them all leaving? We had contracts, they laughed at the contracts. They said "we will never play for Southampton again", and that gave us no choice but to sell them. How would having fans in charge of the club have changed that? What are you going to demonstrate in favour of? Slavery? they wanted to go, and there is naff all (apart from stupid plans like putting all of them in the development squad, leaving us with no money to buy replacements and nothing to pay their wages with).

Wake up and smell the roses; this is the modern game, it's not the fault of the club. United can afford to offer Luke whatever the wages are, £80-100,000 a week, and STILL put him in the reserves if they want to. We can't, and while that is the case the Luke Shaws are always going to go to Utd. And if we say no, you've got a four year contract, they'll refuse to play for us. Or play carp until we sell them.

Please, please, stop putting the blame where it doesn't belong. Slagging the board for this situation is pointless. Saying let's do something is pointless unless you have an actual idea about what to do.

Someone said go to the ground armed with pitchforks. Ok, that was tongue in cheek (I hope!), but what do you do when you are there? What are our proposals?

Stop just being negative, and come up with one single idea that we, as fans, can put into practice. Other than stop supporting the Saints, which I'm never going to do.

Here's mine - stop buying Sky subscriptions. I've never had one, and never will. That's my stand against the money that's ruining football. What's yours? Be negative all you want about what's happened, but be positive about what to do next!
It doesn't matter how much power the fans have got; do you really think that would have stopped them all leaving? We had contracts, they laughed at the contracts. They said "we will never play for Southampton again", and that gave us no choice but to sell them. How would having fans in charge of the club have changed that? What are you going to demonstrate in favour of? Slavery? they wanted to go, and there is naff all (apart from stupid plans like putting all of them in the development squad, leaving us with no money to buy replacements and nothing to pay their wages with). Wake up and smell the roses; this is the modern game, it's not the fault of the club. United can afford to offer Luke whatever the wages are, £80-100,000 a week, and STILL put him in the reserves if they want to. We can't, and while that is the case the Luke Shaws are always going to go to Utd. And if we say no, you've got a four year contract, they'll refuse to play for us. Or play carp until we sell them. Please, please, stop putting the blame where it doesn't belong. Slagging the board for this situation is pointless. Saying let's do something is pointless unless you have an actual idea about what to do. Someone said go to the ground armed with pitchforks. Ok, that was tongue in cheek (I hope!), but what do you do when you are there? What are our proposals? Stop just being negative, and come up with one single idea that we, as fans, can put into practice. Other than stop supporting the Saints, which I'm never going to do. Here's mine - stop buying Sky subscriptions. I've never had one, and never will. That's my stand against the money that's ruining football. What's yours? Be negative all you want about what's happened, but be positive about what to do next! Tony in Liberia
  • Score: 25

2:38am Sat 26 Jul 14

DisplacedFan says...

RK is now assessing the groundskeeper as he is the only one left. Will the last one out the door please close the door. Disgraceful!!!
RK is now assessing the groundskeeper as he is the only one left. Will the last one out the door please close the door. Disgraceful!!! DisplacedFan
  • Score: -1

2:48am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...
I have ideas. I believe in the possibilities of IT and economic incentives to create organization. Groupon.com is an excellent example of the benefits of buying together. I believe that type of idea can be developed further and tailored to the sporting world, including Southampton FC.

First, there are the discounts that can be achieved by buying in flock. Imagine approaching the club and saying "we wan't to buy 10000 shirts, what discount can you give us?". These discounts provide a real incentive to join for many fans with normal incomes.

Second, there should be an online democratic system where issues such as the ones we face now are discussed and votes are cast. "Should Chambers be sold and what price would be acceptable?". The votes of the fan base would provide the official position of member fans.

Finally, there there should be incentives to follow actions decided by the fan base. For example, imagine if it was decided that the fan base would not purchase tickets for a particular match. Fans might be tempted to go against this decision, so there would need to be mechanism in place to counter that temptation, like not being able to get discounts in the future, not having a say, and generally foregoing the privileges of members, which become greater and greater as member numbers grow. Also, being banned from the community when all ones mates are active members would provide a social sanction for many.

Anyway, just ideas...
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...[/p][/quote]I have ideas. I believe in the possibilities of IT and economic incentives to create organization. Groupon.com is an excellent example of the benefits of buying together. I believe that type of idea can be developed further and tailored to the sporting world, including Southampton FC. First, there are the discounts that can be achieved by buying in flock. Imagine approaching the club and saying "we wan't to buy 10000 shirts, what discount can you give us?". These discounts provide a real incentive to join for many fans with normal incomes. Second, there should be an online democratic system where issues such as the ones we face now are discussed and votes are cast. "Should Chambers be sold and what price would be acceptable?". The votes of the fan base would provide the official position of member fans. Finally, there there should be incentives to follow actions decided by the fan base. For example, imagine if it was decided that the fan base would not purchase tickets for a particular match. Fans might be tempted to go against this decision, so there would need to be mechanism in place to counter that temptation, like not being able to get discounts in the future, not having a say, and generally foregoing the privileges of members, which become greater and greater as member numbers grow. Also, being banned from the community when all ones mates are active members would provide a social sanction for many. Anyway, just ideas... BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 0

3:04am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rupert Lowe's Backside says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
As the great CIndy Lauper once said:
"Money changes everything"
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]As the great CIndy Lauper once said: "Money changes everything" Rupert Lowe's Backside
  • Score: 4

3:06am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rupert Lowe's Backside says...

Rupert Lowe's Backside wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
As the great CIndy Lauper once said:
"Money changes everything"
Or was that:

"Girls just want to have fun"...
[quote][p][bold]Rupert Lowe's Backside[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]As the great CIndy Lauper once said: "Money changes everything"[/p][/quote]Or was that: "Girls just want to have fun"... Rupert Lowe's Backside
  • Score: 0

3:19am Sat 26 Jul 14

no left foot says...

The board are either incompetent or compliant to allow this to happen , its true clubs with bigger budgets will attract players from other clubs, but to loose 5 with possibly 2 more to follow is almost the whole team!!
I don't recall that happening before on this scale with any club that's not in financial trouble.
The club is bracing itself ???? its already done the deal chambers didn't play last night.
I have lost all faith in the owner and board and question their integrity
We all know what happens when you sell your best players its a slippery slope .
The board are either incompetent or compliant to allow this to happen , its true clubs with bigger budgets will attract players from other clubs, but to loose 5 with possibly 2 more to follow is almost the whole team!! I don't recall that happening before on this scale with any club that's not in financial trouble. The club is bracing itself ???? its already done the deal chambers didn't play last night. I have lost all faith in the owner and board and question their integrity We all know what happens when you sell your best players its a slippery slope . no left foot
  • Score: 4

3:51am Sat 26 Jul 14

Kokakole says...

I don't know - and neither do any of us - whether the club is going to be sold. But either way this is bad business. If the club is being sold, selling our top 6 players makes it a less attractive investment. If it isn't, selling our top 6 players makes the odds of relegation much, much higher, and thus the club far less profitable for K. Liebherr.
I knew the club would have to sell some players. But it's a fine line between making some money to pay off debts, cashing in on overvalued players (Shaw? Lallana?) and selling of so many players that you: a) precipitate other players' departures and b) make it far harder to attract players from other clubs.
Finally, to all those saying that the club is powerless in the face of player demands to move: if the club wanted to, it could have been tough and prevented at least some of these sales. I'm pretty sure every one of those contracts contains clauses stipulating fines for players refusing to play. I would have liked to have seen how many weeks Lovren or Lallana would have made it without wages and while paying fines before giving in and continuing to play for the club.
Our situation now is truly difficult. Not only do we have to bring in new players (because otherwise we are very good relegation candidates), but we also have to make them gel quickly enough to take advantage of our easiest run of games - the first 10 fixtures. I'm not optimistic....
I don't know - and neither do any of us - whether the club is going to be sold. But either way this is bad business. If the club is being sold, selling our top 6 players makes it a less attractive investment. If it isn't, selling our top 6 players makes the odds of relegation much, much higher, and thus the club far less profitable for K. Liebherr. I knew the club would have to sell some players. But it's a fine line between making some money to pay off debts, cashing in on overvalued players (Shaw? Lallana?) and selling of so many players that you: a) precipitate other players' departures and b) make it far harder to attract players from other clubs. Finally, to all those saying that the club is powerless in the face of player demands to move: if the club wanted to, it could have been tough and prevented at least some of these sales. I'm pretty sure every one of those contracts contains clauses stipulating fines for players refusing to play. I would have liked to have seen how many weeks Lovren or Lallana would have made it without wages and while paying fines before giving in and continuing to play for the club. Our situation now is truly difficult. Not only do we have to bring in new players (because otherwise we are very good relegation candidates), but we also have to make them gel quickly enough to take advantage of our easiest run of games - the first 10 fixtures. I'm not optimistic.... Kokakole
  • Score: 6

4:35am Sat 26 Jul 14

redandy10 says...

It's become a joke now! And to think how many fans were taken in by Les Read's little interview , the club shifted some season tickets though. Some fans have spoken about asset stripping, which I myself found hard to believe, but now what are we to believe?

A few of us predicted that Luke and Adam and probably Lovren would leave, but now Chambers, what on earth is going on?

WHY CAN'T THE CLUB SAY NO FOR ONCE?

THE CLUB OWE US AN EXPLANATION.

THE HAPPY CLAPPERS ARE LOOKING MORE FOOLISH BY THE DAY.
It's become a joke now! And to think how many fans were taken in by Les Read's little interview , the club shifted some season tickets though. Some fans have spoken about asset stripping, which I myself found hard to believe, but now what are we to believe? A few of us predicted that Luke and Adam and probably Lovren would leave, but now Chambers, what on earth is going on? WHY CAN'T THE CLUB SAY NO FOR ONCE? THE CLUB OWE US AN EXPLANATION. THE HAPPY CLAPPERS ARE LOOKING MORE FOOLISH BY THE DAY. redandy10
  • Score: 6

4:49am Sat 26 Jul 14

redandy10 says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
There are a fair few of them either lying low or skulking around with their tails between their legs. It's beyond me how they failed to see the writing on the wall when NC left. The amount of grief they gave posters like us for stating our opinion. I think they saw the light a few weeks ago but they were too stubborn to admit it, and now they just look more foolish. They mugged themselves off big time by sticking to their guns.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]There are a fair few of them either lying low or skulking around with their tails between their legs. It's beyond me how they failed to see the writing on the wall when NC left. The amount of grief they gave posters like us for stating our opinion. I think they saw the light a few weeks ago but they were too stubborn to admit it, and now they just look more foolish. They mugged themselves off big time by sticking to their guns. redandy10
  • Score: 2

4:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
Rising_Son wrote:
BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick.
Not sure. I don't think fans would have objected to every sale that has happened. I also happen to think that a club where fans have a democratically unearthed position on important matters, would be an exceptionally fun club to follow. In other words, revenues may benefit positively. I think fans truly want what is best for the long term future of the club. Any owner with that horizon, and who trusts the knowledge of fans, should not be frightened off.
I agree it would be a fun club to follow. However the closest thing I can think of to this is a club just down the road that plays in blue. The 'rich HNW owners' have now made sure that the supporter shareholders cannot get in the way of their right to decide. I suspect that is what would eventually happen to any other club that tried it too.

I should also imagine the likelihood of abuse being directed at the owner and board (of the kind we see on here) when issues are being discussed, even when the majority agree, would probably discourage any owner from even entertaining the idea.
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Rising_Son[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]Then the owner would probably get out pretty quick.[/p][/quote]Not sure. I don't think fans would have objected to every sale that has happened. I also happen to think that a club where fans have a democratically unearthed position on important matters, would be an exceptionally fun club to follow. In other words, revenues may benefit positively. I think fans truly want what is best for the long term future of the club. Any owner with that horizon, and who trusts the knowledge of fans, should not be frightened off.[/p][/quote]I agree it would be a fun club to follow. However the closest thing I can think of to this is a club just down the road that plays in blue. The 'rich HNW owners' have now made sure that the supporter shareholders cannot get in the way of their right to decide. I suspect that is what would eventually happen to any other club that tried it too. I should also imagine the likelihood of abuse being directed at the owner and board (of the kind we see on here) when issues are being discussed, even when the majority agree, would probably discourage any owner from even entertaining the idea. Rising_Son
  • Score: 3

4:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

Tivysaint says...

Positively4thStreet wrote:
Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired!
Time will tell if this is the worst or best thing that has happened !,millions coming into the club by selling players who think they are better then saints and raw youngsters however promising , we have no choice but to give RK and the board a chance , if the money is not spent on players they will have a lot to answer for. I do a 200 mile round trip to St Mary's to watch saints and have to keep optimistic , there is now other club like our saints , the club , supporters are special so let's all try and get behind them , let's prove the doubters and traitors wrong coyrs
[quote][p][bold]Positively4thStreet[/bold] wrote: Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired![/p][/quote]Time will tell if this is the worst or best thing that has happened !,millions coming into the club by selling players who think they are better then saints and raw youngsters however promising , we have no choice but to give RK and the board a chance , if the money is not spent on players they will have a lot to answer for. I do a 200 mile round trip to St Mary's to watch saints and have to keep optimistic , there is now other club like our saints , the club , supporters are special so let's all try and get behind them , let's prove the doubters and traitors wrong coyrs Tivysaint
  • Score: 7

4:58am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...
I have ideas. I believe in the possibilities of IT and economic incentives to create organization. Groupon.com is an excellent example of the benefits of buying together. I believe that type of idea can be developed further and tailored to the sporting world, including Southampton FC.

First, there are the discounts that can be achieved by buying in flock. Imagine approaching the club and saying "we wan't to buy 10000 shirts, what discount can you give us?". These discounts provide a real incentive to join for many fans with normal incomes.

Second, there should be an online democratic system where issues such as the ones we face now are discussed and votes are cast. "Should Chambers be sold and what price would be acceptable?". The votes of the fan base would provide the official position of member fans.

Finally, there there should be incentives to follow actions decided by the fan base. For example, imagine if it was decided that the fan base would not purchase tickets for a particular match. Fans might be tempted to go against this decision, so there would need to be mechanism in place to counter that temptation, like not being able to get discounts in the future, not having a say, and generally foregoing the privileges of members, which become greater and greater as member numbers grow. Also, being banned from the community when all ones mates are active members would provide a social sanction for many.

Anyway, just ideas...
BigBugBuzzz, Just read your reply to Tony. You seem to be suggesting a Coop.
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]I agree that things would be very different if fans were organised. Any ideas on how to do that? Because I haven't - we can't even organise any Saints Supporters' group that manages to speak for the fans; how would we do it across different groups? Maybe the government could do something, but I'm not holding my breath ...[/p][/quote]I have ideas. I believe in the possibilities of IT and economic incentives to create organization. Groupon.com is an excellent example of the benefits of buying together. I believe that type of idea can be developed further and tailored to the sporting world, including Southampton FC. First, there are the discounts that can be achieved by buying in flock. Imagine approaching the club and saying "we wan't to buy 10000 shirts, what discount can you give us?". These discounts provide a real incentive to join for many fans with normal incomes. Second, there should be an online democratic system where issues such as the ones we face now are discussed and votes are cast. "Should Chambers be sold and what price would be acceptable?". The votes of the fan base would provide the official position of member fans. Finally, there there should be incentives to follow actions decided by the fan base. For example, imagine if it was decided that the fan base would not purchase tickets for a particular match. Fans might be tempted to go against this decision, so there would need to be mechanism in place to counter that temptation, like not being able to get discounts in the future, not having a say, and generally foregoing the privileges of members, which become greater and greater as member numbers grow. Also, being banned from the community when all ones mates are active members would provide a social sanction for many. Anyway, just ideas...[/p][/quote]BigBugBuzzz, Just read your reply to Tony. You seem to be suggesting a Coop. Rising_Son
  • Score: 2

5:18am Sat 26 Jul 14

VancouverSaint says...

It all comes down to business in the world we live in today. Silly, stupid money for players is good business. Chambers for £16-20, Lalanna, Shaw, Lovren, all crazy .Katarina has a good profit for what her Dad paid for the club. She would be smart to buy players to replace this bunch at half the price and stay in the PL. £80m just to stay in is huge on it's own rights. It all comes down to business. We all get passionate about our club and players but its not the same as it was 20 years ago. Ted Bates and George Reader are gone. Its now a business for profit. Long live Saints, God Bless us All!!
It all comes down to business in the world we live in today. Silly, stupid money for players is good business. Chambers for £16-20, Lalanna, Shaw, Lovren, all crazy .Katarina has a good profit for what her Dad paid for the club. She would be smart to buy players to replace this bunch at half the price and stay in the PL. £80m just to stay in is huge on it's own rights. It all comes down to business. We all get passionate about our club and players but its not the same as it was 20 years ago. Ted Bates and George Reader are gone. Its now a business for profit. Long live Saints, God Bless us All!! VancouverSaint
  • Score: 14

5:44am Sat 26 Jul 14

Knackers says...

redandy10 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............


. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
There are a fair few of them either lying low or skulking around with their tails between their legs. It's beyond me how they failed to see the writing on the wall when NC left. The amount of grief they gave posters like us for stating our opinion. I think they saw the light a few weeks ago but they were too stubborn to admit it, and now they just look more foolish. They mugged themselves off big time by sticking to their guns.
Yep they pretty much has their heads in the sand.this is a firesale.
Les reed lied.we will struggle now.
[quote][p][bold]redandy10[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]There are a fair few of them either lying low or skulking around with their tails between their legs. It's beyond me how they failed to see the writing on the wall when NC left. The amount of grief they gave posters like us for stating our opinion. I think they saw the light a few weeks ago but they were too stubborn to admit it, and now they just look more foolish. They mugged themselves off big time by sticking to their guns.[/p][/quote]Yep they pretty much has their heads in the sand.this is a firesale. Les reed lied.we will struggle now. Knackers
  • Score: 3

6:05am Sat 26 Jul 14

Knackers says...

de Heiligen paard 101 wrote:
saints1998 wrote:
I want a refund for my season ticket.
Well ring up the club and ask then! Go on give it a try see what they say.

I don't think you will get very far as season tickets are brought to watch Southampton football club, they don't say which players have to be in the squad/team.

You should have had a word with Costa Gaz before you brought it, he saw this all coming a long time ago and he might have told you about it.

So if you ring and get your refund tomorrow and then next week we sign 5 really good players will you want your ticket back?
"We sign 5 really good players" you are not living in reality.
You backed this management team all the way and clapped and cheered as they sold our future.are you even a saints fan? Everyone of your posts ridiculed anyone who questioned the decisions being made by the club.
Do you still think les and Ralph are the right men to take us forward?
Do you need some tissues for that egg on your face? You confuse individuals as being the club,no the supporters are the club and hold power as kat will find out.real supporters care enough to question not blindly follow.no doubt you will be on here shouting down anyone who questions why Morgan had to so soon after chambers.
Are you les reed? Or a skate?
[quote][p][bold]de Heiligen paard 101[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]saints1998[/bold] wrote: I want a refund for my season ticket.[/p][/quote]Well ring up the club and ask then! Go on give it a try see what they say. I don't think you will get very far as season tickets are brought to watch Southampton football club, they don't say which players have to be in the squad/team. You should have had a word with Costa Gaz before you brought it, he saw this all coming a long time ago and he might have told you about it. So if you ring and get your refund tomorrow and then next week we sign 5 really good players will you want your ticket back?[/p][/quote]"We sign 5 really good players" you are not living in reality. You backed this management team all the way and clapped and cheered as they sold our future.are you even a saints fan? Everyone of your posts ridiculed anyone who questioned the decisions being made by the club. Do you still think les and Ralph are the right men to take us forward? Do you need some tissues for that egg on your face? You confuse individuals as being the club,no the supporters are the club and hold power as kat will find out.real supporters care enough to question not blindly follow.no doubt you will be on here shouting down anyone who questions why Morgan had to so soon after chambers. Are you les reed? Or a skate? Knackers
  • Score: -1

6:12am Sat 26 Jul 14

Saint Clements says...

This time a year ago my father-in-law invited me round for Sunday lunch.
He's a Watford fan.
Talk, as it invariably does, moved onto football and the upcoming season.
I said I'd never been more excited.
He said: Don't be.
He said: If you too well, your best players will just be bought.
How sad is that? I thought.
And how wrong, too.
With the The Don in charge I felt safe.
Then The Don left.
The the player-sale rumours began.
Then Fat Kat's cronies started appearing on TV telling me it'd all be ok.
Heand-on-heart, I knew Les was a puppet-muppet.
But I ignored it.
I buried my head in the sand.
I believed in Fat Kat.
I respected The Canadian Motivational Speaker.
I was wrong.
Don't get me wrong, I'll support us to my last breath.
And I'm not saying we'll go down - heck, we may even make the top-half.
But if this regime stay then my father-in-law will continue to be right.
I repeat: how sad is that?
This time a year ago my father-in-law invited me round for Sunday lunch. He's a Watford fan. Talk, as it invariably does, moved onto football and the upcoming season. I said I'd never been more excited. He said: Don't be. He said: If you too well, your best players will just be bought. How sad is that? I thought. And how wrong, too. With the The Don in charge I felt safe. Then The Don left. The the player-sale rumours began. Then Fat Kat's cronies started appearing on TV telling me it'd all be ok. Heand-on-heart, I knew Les was a puppet-muppet. But I ignored it. I buried my head in the sand. I believed in Fat Kat. I respected The Canadian Motivational Speaker. I was wrong. Don't get me wrong, I'll support us to my last breath. And I'm not saying we'll go down - heck, we may even make the top-half. But if this regime stay then my father-in-law will continue to be right. I repeat: how sad is that? Saint Clements
  • Score: -8

6:36am Sat 26 Jul 14

Knackers says...

Saint Clements wrote:
This time a year ago my father-in-law invited me round for Sunday lunch.
He's a Watford fan.
Talk, as it invariably does, moved onto football and the upcoming season.
I said I'd never been more excited.
He said: Don't be.
He said: If you too well, your best players will just be bought.
How sad is that? I thought.
And how wrong, too.
With the The Don in charge I felt safe.
Then The Don left.
The the player-sale rumours began.
Then Fat Kat's cronies started appearing on TV telling me it'd all be ok.
Heand-on-heart, I knew Les was a puppet-muppet.
But I ignored it.
I buried my head in the sand.
I believed in Fat Kat.
I respected The Canadian Motivational Speaker.
I was wrong.
Don't get me wrong, I'll support us to my last breath.
And I'm not saying we'll go down - heck, we may even make the top-half.
But if this regime stay then my father-in-law will continue to be right.
I repeat: how sad is that?
That is sad but true.some of us saw what was happening and tried to open debate and air our misgivings. Posters like les heiligen just refused to hear anything against the management team and just labelled us wums.hopefully we can now talk openly and get a debate going,let's put pressure on this hierarchy and demand answers.
I hope things turn around and your father in law turns out to be wrong.
[quote][p][bold]Saint Clements[/bold] wrote: This time a year ago my father-in-law invited me round for Sunday lunch. He's a Watford fan. Talk, as it invariably does, moved onto football and the upcoming season. I said I'd never been more excited. He said: Don't be. He said: If you too well, your best players will just be bought. How sad is that? I thought. And how wrong, too. With the The Don in charge I felt safe. Then The Don left. The the player-sale rumours began. Then Fat Kat's cronies started appearing on TV telling me it'd all be ok. Heand-on-heart, I knew Les was a puppet-muppet. But I ignored it. I buried my head in the sand. I believed in Fat Kat. I respected The Canadian Motivational Speaker. I was wrong. Don't get me wrong, I'll support us to my last breath. And I'm not saying we'll go down - heck, we may even make the top-half. But if this regime stay then my father-in-law will continue to be right. I repeat: how sad is that?[/p][/quote]That is sad but true.some of us saw what was happening and tried to open debate and air our misgivings. Posters like les heiligen just refused to hear anything against the management team and just labelled us wums.hopefully we can now talk openly and get a debate going,let's put pressure on this hierarchy and demand answers. I hope things turn around and your father in law turns out to be wrong. Knackers
  • Score: -2

6:38am Sat 26 Jul 14

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. says...

RED ARMY - FIGHT AND WIN

OWNER - BOARD - AND CHAIRMAN SHOULD ISSUE A HANDS OFF WARNING NOW.

COYR+WS
RED ARMY - FIGHT AND WIN OWNER - BOARD - AND CHAIRMAN SHOULD ISSUE A HANDS OFF WARNING NOW. COYR+WS The Rise of The Foot Soldier.
  • Score: 0

6:39am Sat 26 Jul 14

willygetaway says...

this is what i mean by an asset strip , GET THIS BOARD OUT NOW BEFORE ITS TOO LATE love my team hate this F**KING BOARD
SAINTS TILL I DIE
this is what i mean by an asset strip , GET THIS BOARD OUT NOW BEFORE ITS TOO LATE love my team hate this F**KING BOARD SAINTS TILL I DIE willygetaway
  • Score: -1

6:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

Dan Howard says...

SwissToni wrote:
Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now.
If this is true its great business.

£16m for a largely untried emergent full back to whom we cant even offer first team football when we've already got a very good one in place who should have played in Brasil before Johnson.

Take the money, because they've got to be mad to offer it.
[quote][p][bold]SwissToni[/bold] wrote: Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now.[/p][/quote]If this is true its great business. £16m for a largely untried emergent full back to whom we cant even offer first team football when we've already got a very good one in place who should have played in Brasil before Johnson. Take the money, because they've got to be mad to offer it. Dan Howard
  • Score: -1

6:47am Sat 26 Jul 14

THE12THMAN says...

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. wrote:
RED ARMY - FIGHT AND WIN

OWNER - BOARD - AND CHAIRMAN SHOULD ISSUE A HANDS OFF WARNING NOW.

COYR+WS
You have got more chance of the board putting up a sign saying SALE-EVERYTHING MUST GO.
[quote][p][bold]The Rise of The Foot Soldier.[/bold] wrote: RED ARMY - FIGHT AND WIN OWNER - BOARD - AND CHAIRMAN SHOULD ISSUE A HANDS OFF WARNING NOW. COYR+WS[/p][/quote]You have got more chance of the board putting up a sign saying SALE-EVERYTHING MUST GO. THE12THMAN
  • Score: 4

6:53am Sat 26 Jul 14

willygetaway says...

ANY ONE OUT THERE WANNA BUY MY STRIPED SAINTS SHIRT ?, NO PREVIOUS OWNERS what a friggin joke we are becoming. I think we could sell the Ted Bates statue ? its made of bronze and must have some value ?
I am AND EVER WILL BE saints TILL THEY DIE.
Which is soon if we don't do something
ANY ONE OUT THERE WANNA BUY MY STRIPED SAINTS SHIRT ?, NO PREVIOUS OWNERS what a friggin joke we are becoming. I think we could sell the Ted Bates statue ? its made of bronze and must have some value ? I am AND EVER WILL BE saints TILL THEY DIE. Which is soon if we don't do something willygetaway
  • Score: -1

6:56am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Fact. At the end of last season we drew with Manchester United and no one raised an eyebrow. It was an entirely expected event. Fact. If we lose to Manchester United by more than 7 goals next time we play, it will raise few eyebrows. It will be an expected event for many, given the decision of our Board to play "let's count our money". How grotesque...
Fact. At the end of last season we drew with Manchester United and no one raised an eyebrow. It was an entirely expected event. Fact. If we lose to Manchester United by more than 7 goals next time we play, it will raise few eyebrows. It will be an expected event for many, given the decision of our Board to play "let's count our money". How grotesque... BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: -5

6:57am Sat 26 Jul 14

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. says...

12Th MAN - I read your post.

SAINTS FANS have plenty of PASSION and FIGHT and combined with the Club are ready to challenge everton for a European Place.

WHY ON EARTH would the Owner Chairman and Baord wish to sell our young talent like Chambers.

COYR+WS
12Th MAN - I read your post. SAINTS FANS have plenty of PASSION and FIGHT and combined with the Club are ready to challenge everton for a European Place. WHY ON EARTH would the Owner Chairman and Baord wish to sell our young talent like Chambers. COYR+WS The Rise of The Foot Soldier.
  • Score: 3

6:59am Sat 26 Jul 14

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. says...

FIGHT AND WIN

at the next game vs BRIGHTON AWAY .....

At the Bar and on the Terraces ...

WE REALLY WILL BE CHANTING - SACK THE BOARD - SACK THE BOARD.
COYR+WS
FIGHT AND WIN at the next game vs BRIGHTON AWAY ..... At the Bar and on the Terraces ... WE REALLY WILL BE CHANTING - SACK THE BOARD - SACK THE BOARD. COYR+WS The Rise of The Foot Soldier.
  • Score: -1

7:04am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

To all those who say "hey, great business" you are so right, spot on! For an owner on the way out....

The problem is of course we are left with a football club that can't play football, and have no money to spend once the owner packs her purse and leaves.

The best thing going for us is the training facility, because that she can't easily sell. Perhaps that is really why Cortese was shown the door? He tied up liquidity.
To all those who say "hey, great business" you are so right, spot on! For an owner on the way out.... The problem is of course we are left with a football club that can't play football, and have no money to spend once the owner packs her purse and leaves. The best thing going for us is the training facility, because that she can't easily sell. Perhaps that is really why Cortese was shown the door? He tied up liquidity. BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 5

7:07am Sat 26 Jul 14

THE12THMAN says...

A couple of months ago when people on here started talking about asset stripping I had my doubts, but it now looks like those people were right, I just hope there is someone out there who is a proper football fan and will buy our club before this board ruins it. It could take years to build a team as good as the one we had last season.
A couple of months ago when people on here started talking about asset stripping I had my doubts, but it now looks like those people were right, I just hope there is someone out there who is a proper football fan and will buy our club before this board ruins it. It could take years to build a team as good as the one we had last season. THE12THMAN
  • Score: 3

7:08am Sat 26 Jul 14

Epsom Saint says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Great post, thanks.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Great post, thanks. Epsom Saint
  • Score: 7

7:10am Sat 26 Jul 14

sm170368 says...

There will be no fire sale at this club!! Seems like everyone is up for sale at the right price!! The exit door is very busy, the worrying thing is that we don't appear to be in any hurry to bring in any replacements. Until we sign 2 or 3 quality replacements, the speculation over the future of the club will continue. Still hopeful this will happen, but Saints seem to be cutting it a little fine with the season almost upon us.
There will be no fire sale at this club!! Seems like everyone is up for sale at the right price!! The exit door is very busy, the worrying thing is that we don't appear to be in any hurry to bring in any replacements. Until we sign 2 or 3 quality replacements, the speculation over the future of the club will continue. Still hopeful this will happen, but Saints seem to be cutting it a little fine with the season almost upon us. sm170368
  • Score: 7

7:13am Sat 26 Jul 14

just kidding says...

This is a frikin outrage if true , I am totally losing my rag now . If this is true and we lose Chambers then you can go **** yourself Southhampton FC board. You have complety lost the plot, yes you can run a business but you don't have a clue about football, and the passion of the fans. Yea I know it's all about money, but if you think it's just that then you are really stupid ( and lucky). I frikin hate how you have treated us. We are the life blood of the club and we deserve more than you . We travel far and wide to support the team and city we love , and you haven,t the decency to at least make some official statement as to what the hell is going on. I like many others began the summer with so much hope and optimism , but you guys didn't have a clue how to handle what was going down. I can understand that a lot was out of your control. But you lacked sensitivity and transparency in dealing with the most valuable entity , the fans . This has to stop. We need good news now , we need some guys holding shirts . Finally you have to realize how much we hate Liverpool and Spurs and how we really want to rub their noses in it.
This is a frikin outrage if true , I am totally losing my rag now . If this is true and we lose Chambers then you can go **** yourself Southhampton FC board. You have complety lost the plot, yes you can run a business but you don't have a clue about football, and the passion of the fans. Yea I know it's all about money, but if you think it's just that then you are really stupid ( and lucky). I frikin hate how you have treated us. We are the life blood of the club and we deserve more than you . We travel far and wide to support the team and city we love , and you haven,t the decency to at least make some official statement as to what the hell is going on. I like many others began the summer with so much hope and optimism , but you guys didn't have a clue how to handle what was going down. I can understand that a lot was out of your control. But you lacked sensitivity and transparency in dealing with the most valuable entity , the fans . This has to stop. We need good news now , we need some guys holding shirts . Finally you have to realize how much we hate Liverpool and Spurs and how we really want to rub their noses in it. just kidding
  • Score: 4

7:13am Sat 26 Jul 14

BigBugBuzzz says...

Tony said: "we can't compete with the top 6 on wages".

Well, we didn't need to, that is what we agreed with all those players who only recently signed long term contracts....
Tony said: "we can't compete with the top 6 on wages". Well, we didn't need to, that is what we agreed with all those players who only recently signed long term contracts.... BigBugBuzzz
  • Score: 8

7:14am Sat 26 Jul 14

Epsom Saint says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.
Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?
Problem with that is that fans have varying opinions - nothing would improve.
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Mostly agree with that, well balanced view.[/p][/quote]Your hypothesis hinges on your assumption that fans are mostly like you, easy to please. If fans were organized, things would be different. Imagine if fans could veto important decisions?[/p][/quote]Problem with that is that fans have varying opinions - nothing would improve. Epsom Saint
  • Score: 1

7:16am Sat 26 Jul 14

THE12THMAN says...

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. wrote:
12Th MAN - I read your post.

SAINTS FANS have plenty of PASSION and FIGHT and combined with the Club are ready to challenge everton for a European Place.

WHY ON EARTH would the Owner Chairman and Baord wish to sell our young talent like Chambers.

COYR+WS
The reason the board would sell a talent like chambers is because they have been told to by KL, I think she wants to recoup the money Cortese spent before she sells the club, that's my opinion, I might be wrong but only time will tell. Our team is getting weaker by the day.
[quote][p][bold]The Rise of The Foot Soldier.[/bold] wrote: 12Th MAN - I read your post. SAINTS FANS have plenty of PASSION and FIGHT and combined with the Club are ready to challenge everton for a European Place. WHY ON EARTH would the Owner Chairman and Baord wish to sell our young talent like Chambers. COYR+WS[/p][/quote]The reason the board would sell a talent like chambers is because they have been told to by KL, I think she wants to recoup the money Cortese spent before she sells the club, that's my opinion, I might be wrong but only time will tell. Our team is getting weaker by the day. THE12THMAN
  • Score: 2

7:16am Sat 26 Jul 14

Sally Hamilton Original says...

Right.... With Koeman being told if we sell he gets the money to buy players...WHY DOES HE HAVE TO WAIT FOR LOVREN AND CHAMBERS AND SPIDER-MAN TO BE SOLD BEFORE HE GETS NEW PLAYERS IN? With less than 4 weeks to go, including tv money we would have got £205m, yet we have signed only 2 players... This is an absolute joke. LES REED YOU HAVE TOLD US FANS NOTHING BUT LIES. You said we didn't have to sell, yet all our decent players are going or have gone. This is a disgrace
Right.... With Koeman being told if we sell he gets the money to buy players...WHY DOES HE HAVE TO WAIT FOR LOVREN AND CHAMBERS AND SPIDER-MAN TO BE SOLD BEFORE HE GETS NEW PLAYERS IN? With less than 4 weeks to go, including tv money we would have got £205m, yet we have signed only 2 players... This is an absolute joke. LES REED YOU HAVE TOLD US FANS NOTHING BUT LIES. You said we didn't have to sell, yet all our decent players are going or have gone. This is a disgrace Sally Hamilton Original
  • Score: 17

7:25am Sat 26 Jul 14

centre circle says...

steekeemcglue wrote:
if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.
I agree.....but I already bought my season ticket !!
[quote][p][bold]steekeemcglue[/bold] wrote: if true then only idiots will pay to watch Saints at the stadium.[/p][/quote]I agree.....but I already bought my season ticket !! centre circle
  • Score: 3

7:25am Sat 26 Jul 14

Lymosaint says...

This concerns me...the official website report of the Bournemouth friendly states: 'Defensive pair Calum Chambers and Dejan Lovren were both ruled out through illness...'

Surely, this a lie and they were ruled out through being sold. If indeed it is untrue, it says all we need to know about the 'honesty and transparency' we were promised earlier in the year.


Read more at http://www.saintsfc.
co.uk/news/article/2
5072014-report-afc-b
ournemouth-0-1-south
ampton-1783116.aspx#
Exjz4FJySaSZ2KUt.99
This concerns me...the official website report of the Bournemouth friendly states: 'Defensive pair Calum Chambers and Dejan Lovren were both ruled out through illness...' Surely, this a lie and they were ruled out through being sold. If indeed it is untrue, it says all we need to know about the 'honesty and transparency' we were promised earlier in the year. Read more at http://www.saintsfc. co.uk/news/article/2 5072014-report-afc-b ournemouth-0-1-south ampton-1783116.aspx# Exjz4FJySaSZ2KUt.99 Lymosaint
  • Score: 8

7:26am Sat 26 Jul 14

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. says...

Sally Hamilton Original wrote:
Right.... With Koeman being told if we sell he gets the money to buy players...WHY DOES HE HAVE TO WAIT FOR LOVREN AND CHAMBERS AND SPIDER-MAN TO BE SOLD BEFORE HE GETS NEW PLAYERS IN? With less than 4 weeks to go, including tv money we would have got £205m, yet we have signed only 2 players... This is an absolute joke. LES REED YOU HAVE TOLD US FANS NOTHING BUT LIES. You said we didn't have to sell, yet all our decent players are going or have gone. This is a disgrace
FIGHT AND WIN TO SAVE OUR CLUB

Sally

SAINTS FANS REALLY HAVE TO MAKE A STAND NOW.

FLOOD THE DAILY ECHO + CLUB WITH CALLS AND PROTEST NOW.

NEXT AWAY GAME - MAKE OUR FEELINGS KNOWN.

COYR+WS
[quote][p][bold]Sally Hamilton Original[/bold] wrote: Right.... With Koeman being told if we sell he gets the money to buy players...WHY DOES HE HAVE TO WAIT FOR LOVREN AND CHAMBERS AND SPIDER-MAN TO BE SOLD BEFORE HE GETS NEW PLAYERS IN? With less than 4 weeks to go, including tv money we would have got £205m, yet we have signed only 2 players... This is an absolute joke. LES REED YOU HAVE TOLD US FANS NOTHING BUT LIES. You said we didn't have to sell, yet all our decent players are going or have gone. This is a disgrace[/p][/quote]FIGHT AND WIN TO SAVE OUR CLUB Sally SAINTS FANS REALLY HAVE TO MAKE A STAND NOW. FLOOD THE DAILY ECHO + CLUB WITH CALLS AND PROTEST NOW. NEXT AWAY GAME - MAKE OUR FEELINGS KNOWN. COYR+WS The Rise of The Foot Soldier.
  • Score: 3

7:32am Sat 26 Jul 14

ctsaint says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Well put Tony. I don't like seeing a settled team dismantled , the fact is we can't compete on wages, and may never be able to...

We have a fantastic business model that gives us a long term future and stability. If managed correctly this club should never see the likes of what happened 6 years ago again.

We have a famed academy, we are promoting them to first team football, Targett, Reed , Gallagher and Isgrove will be the new Laliar and Shaw ........that seems to be forgotten on here by some, there are no doubt others too - this will continue to attract the BEST youngsters who will see a career path for themselves at SFC.

All the while the positive income flow gives us significant options if we do want to deal in the market. We will still have a very British heart if you look at this years academy players breaking into the squad, and I prefer this to a wholesale purchase of relatively unknowns from other leagues, the Southampton Way is partly about promoting the youth from within.

And to those of you making abusive remarks about Kat Leibher you are a disgrace......
It's almost as if some "fans" of the club want us to "chase the dream" ask Leeds fans about that and where it ended , and Pompey fans for that matter........the same fans will moan about whoever we buy if they don't perform like footballing gods in their first few games, blame the board and label them a waste of money.

The business model is sound, and with long term planning might, just might give us the success we crave. I never imagined we would do as well as we did last year , and I have low expectations for this , but I remain a fan and keep a balanced view, some of you should try being a little more reflective and trusting in the very thing that got us our success.........the academy and the Liebhers.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Well put Tony. I don't like seeing a settled team dismantled , the fact is we can't compete on wages, and may never be able to... We have a fantastic business model that gives us a long term future and stability. If managed correctly this club should never see the likes of what happened 6 years ago again. We have a famed academy, we are promoting them to first team football, Targett, Reed , Gallagher and Isgrove will be the new Laliar and Shaw ........that seems to be forgotten on here by some, there are no doubt others too - this will continue to attract the BEST youngsters who will see a career path for themselves at SFC. All the while the positive income flow gives us significant options if we do want to deal in the market. We will still have a very British heart if you look at this years academy players breaking into the squad, and I prefer this to a wholesale purchase of relatively unknowns from other leagues, the Southampton Way is partly about promoting the youth from within. And to those of you making abusive remarks about Kat Leibher you are a disgrace...... It's almost as if some "fans" of the club want us to "chase the dream" ask Leeds fans about that and where it ended , and Pompey fans for that matter........the same fans will moan about whoever we buy if they don't perform like footballing gods in their first few games, blame the board and label them a waste of money. The business model is sound, and with long term planning might, just might give us the success we crave. I never imagined we would do as well as we did last year , and I have low expectations for this , but I remain a fan and keep a balanced view, some of you should try being a little more reflective and trusting in the very thing that got us our success.........the academy and the Liebhers. ctsaint
  • Score: 22

7:33am Sat 26 Jul 14

C.R.R.A says...

I hope someone tells Thunder Thighs not to come to St. Marys again.
I hope someone tells Thunder Thighs not to come to St. Marys again. C.R.R.A
  • Score: -19

7:35am Sat 26 Jul 14

Swissowned says...

This is the last straw and has tempted me to make a rare comment.

This is a joke, an absolute joke. I'm seriously hacked off even though I expected some of our talent to be leaving in the summer. But this has now gone too far. He's under contract until 2017 so just say "no." I don't care if they come back with 30, 35 or 40 million. Enough is enough.

At this rate, for the opening game of the season, the Liverpool first eleven will be lining up at anfield against a huge sack of cash.
:(

My only personal consolation is that this justifies my difficult decision not to renew my season ticket this year.
This is the last straw and has tempted me to make a rare comment. This is a joke, an absolute joke. I'm seriously hacked off even though I expected some of our talent to be leaving in the summer. But this has now gone too far. He's under contract until 2017 so just say "no." I don't care if they come back with 30, 35 or 40 million. Enough is enough. At this rate, for the opening game of the season, the Liverpool first eleven will be lining up at anfield against a huge sack of cash. :( My only personal consolation is that this justifies my difficult decision not to renew my season ticket this year. Swissowned
  • Score: 8

7:36am Sat 26 Jul 14

Saintsayer II says...

Next headline RoKo packs his bags Les Reed appointed as the next manager Some of the dumbos on here would still try to find a positive in that
I will contact SMS on Monday re a refund of my ST If they say NO which I expect then I will contact trading standards
Next headline RoKo packs his bags Les Reed appointed as the next manager Some of the dumbos on here would still try to find a positive in that I will contact SMS on Monday re a refund of my ST If they say NO which I expect then I will contact trading standards Saintsayer II
  • Score: 14

7:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

warrens 76 says...

SwissToni wrote:
Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now.
Several posters have not gone down well with the 'believing in the board set'..our eyes are being forced wide open , this is sacrilege.
[quote][p][bold]SwissToni[/bold] wrote: Oh ffs, this is beyond a joke now.[/p][/quote]Several posters have not gone down well with the 'believing in the board set'..our eyes are being forced wide open , this is sacrilege. warrens 76
  • Score: 3

7:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

Chapperall says...

Blue means Success wrote:
So, what are the fans going to do about it.

Just say - O well, and make a cup of tea - musn't grumble eh?

The Southampton way
Yes just like those idiots who were on talk sport yesterday. All they could say hey ho we will never be a top club and selling players is good business. Nor sure what planet they were on!
This current board are out of their depth as they have lost control and are quickly becoming a laughing stock. They have lost all credibility as they make statement like we are not a selling club and we will invest in new players. The evidence suggest something different and the majority of Saints supporters are losing faith quickly.
To Les Reid and the board there is a word no!
If we are in a relegation dog fight we only have ourselves to blame, and there will be calls for the board to be sacked.
In all business you invest to improve and gain market share. You sell your best products when you need the money. Is there something going on that we the supporters are unaware? We pay one of the highest price for season tickets, and you don't mind doing that if you are watching and supporting a progressive team.
Get a grip Les Reid and start saying no and bring some players in !
Yours a truly fed up Saints supporter!
[quote][p][bold]Blue means Success[/bold] wrote: So, what are the fans going to do about it. Just say - O well, and make a cup of tea - musn't grumble eh? The Southampton way[/p][/quote]Yes just like those idiots who were on talk sport yesterday. All they could say hey ho we will never be a top club and selling players is good business. Nor sure what planet they were on! This current board are out of their depth as they have lost control and are quickly becoming a laughing stock. They have lost all credibility as they make statement like we are not a selling club and we will invest in new players. The evidence suggest something different and the majority of Saints supporters are losing faith quickly. To Les Reid and the board there is a word no! If we are in a relegation dog fight we only have ourselves to blame, and there will be calls for the board to be sacked. In all business you invest to improve and gain market share. You sell your best products when you need the money. Is there something going on that we the supporters are unaware? We pay one of the highest price for season tickets, and you don't mind doing that if you are watching and supporting a progressive team. Get a grip Les Reid and start saying no and bring some players in ! Yours a truly fed up Saints supporter! Chapperall
  • Score: 0

7:48am Sat 26 Jul 14

GX Saint says...

BigBugBuzzz wrote:
Tony said: "we can't compete with the top 6 on wages".

Well, we didn't need to, that is what we agreed with all those players who only recently signed long term contracts....
It's the fact that these players were on long term contracts that we are getting so much money for them. If a player wants to go there's little the board can do if a top 4 club comes in with a high offer to us and a promise of top personal terms to the player. Getting our key players to sign long term deals is a vital step in protecting the club.

The club is healthy, the development set up is the best in the country but to run the club properly with a 32,000 capacity stadium the board has to pay sensible salaries to players (Fair Play). Which means this cycle will continue. 5 years ago if someone had listed the names of the players sold this summer and the amounts of money obtained we'd have been ecstatic. 8th place finish, huge money in the coffers, still the best youth player conveyor belt in the country, decent manager, couple of decent signings (more in the pipeline).
Of course it's disheartening to lose Chambers and Lovren (though, like Osvaldo, he can't stay now anyway) and Schneiderlin will be another blow if he goes. But the board aren't touting these players, they are resisting the suitors until the money gets stupid. But they know they can't keep a player who wants to go when a huge bid comes in.
I think we should cut them some sack and trust their judgement. Some of the money on the table is plain stupid - I'm sure there will be some very decent replacements coming in. The immediate question from me is did J-Rod sign a long term deal yet?
[quote][p][bold]BigBugBuzzz[/bold] wrote: Tony said: "we can't compete with the top 6 on wages". Well, we didn't need to, that is what we agreed with all those players who only recently signed long term contracts....[/p][/quote]It's the fact that these players were on long term contracts that we are getting so much money for them. If a player wants to go there's little the board can do if a top 4 club comes in with a high offer to us and a promise of top personal terms to the player. Getting our key players to sign long term deals is a vital step in protecting the club. The club is healthy, the development set up is the best in the country but to run the club properly with a 32,000 capacity stadium the board has to pay sensible salaries to players (Fair Play). Which means this cycle will continue. 5 years ago if someone had listed the names of the players sold this summer and the amounts of money obtained we'd have been ecstatic. 8th place finish, huge money in the coffers, still the best youth player conveyor belt in the country, decent manager, couple of decent signings (more in the pipeline). Of course it's disheartening to lose Chambers and Lovren (though, like Osvaldo, he can't stay now anyway) and Schneiderlin will be another blow if he goes. But the board aren't touting these players, they are resisting the suitors until the money gets stupid. But they know they can't keep a player who wants to go when a huge bid comes in. I think we should cut them some sack and trust their judgement. Some of the money on the table is plain stupid - I'm sure there will be some very decent replacements coming in. The immediate question from me is did J-Rod sign a long term deal yet? GX Saint
  • Score: 7

7:48am Sat 26 Jul 14

Havant Saint says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
At last a fan speaking sense. We are Saints supporters whoever is on the pitch. We can't expect the players to miss opportunities to cash in by moving. Lets look foward to next season and hope we attract even better players.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]At last a fan speaking sense. We are Saints supporters whoever is on the pitch. We can't expect the players to miss opportunities to cash in by moving. Lets look foward to next season and hope we attract even better players. Havant Saint
  • Score: 3

7:48am Sat 26 Jul 14

saintand266 says...

I've been away for a few days and been unable to see any news.
I half expected lovren to have gone when I got back but now chambers possibly going ? I'm lost for words !!

Although I'm waiting for my phone to ring to see if diverpool or whoever are going to offer me silly money to come and support them .
I've been away for a few days and been unable to see any news. I half expected lovren to have gone when I got back but now chambers possibly going ? I'm lost for words !! Although I'm waiting for my phone to ring to see if diverpool or whoever are going to offer me silly money to come and support them . saintand266
  • Score: 2

7:48am Sat 26 Jul 14

the Newmarket Saint says...

I feel mlike writing something but I am lost for words
I feel mlike writing something but I am lost for words the Newmarket Saint
  • Score: 3

7:56am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rank Xerox says...

We have two new players and have/are selling how many? At this rate we will have a stash of cash to spend in the Championship next season that's if KL hasn't off loaded the club. One step forward, 10 steps back.
We have two new players and have/are selling how many? At this rate we will have a stash of cash to spend in the Championship next season that's if KL hasn't off loaded the club. One step forward, 10 steps back. Rank Xerox
  • Score: 2

8:01am Sat 26 Jul 14

redsnapper says...

We are getting mugged! This has gone far enough now but unfortunately Les Reed is going for "salesman of the year award" .

If Arsenal can see the potential of Chambers as Centre Half then why can't we because we bloody well need two!!!!
Fonte is Championship material at best so he ll be ok next season if he stays.

Get a grip Les the only player we want you to sell is Osvaldo...or is that too hard.
We are getting mugged! This has gone far enough now but unfortunately Les Reed is going for "salesman of the year award" . If Arsenal can see the potential of Chambers as Centre Half then why can't we because we bloody well need two!!!! Fonte is Championship material at best so he ll be ok next season if he stays. Get a grip Les the only player we want you to sell is Osvaldo...or is that too hard. redsnapper
  • Score: 8

8:02am Sat 26 Jul 14

BracknellSaint says...

Tony in Liberia has eloquently said what I was thinking.
The bottom line, like it or not, is that if these players do well for us, and get in the spotlight, one of the big 6 will come along, and offer them 100k a week. It's just something we cannot and will not be able to pay. Simple as that. Yes, maybe they will sit on the bench, but they're still going to get that 100k, every week.
Would any of us, if offered a job at a rival firm, on 3-4 times (maybe even5?) times more money? Even if we knew that maybe our current workmates were nicer, and that the projects at the new place wouldn't be as exciting, and we'd have more time stuck behind a desk, rather than out meeting clients or seeing the world? And I repeat, maybe FIVE TIMES MORE WAGES...
Football teams make their money from TV, and sponsorship. Gate receipts are important, but no longer the key factor.
Man Utd aren't able to pay top dollar because of the capacity of Old Trafford, but because they have a 750 million quid shirt sponsorship, and TV money from all over the world.
These past few years we've invested in the long term future of the club, with a state of the art training facility. This will allow is to attract the very best youngsters, and we will continue to develop top class talent, as we have already been made famous for. However, until the day that we can pay these kids the fortunes on offer in Manchester,Liverpool or London, they will want to move on as soon as they have a good season.
Les Reed was very naive to say there would be no fire sale, but in a way he was not wrong. We aren't selling because we have debts to clear, we're selling because these players now suddenly have fame, and agents know they can get a huge rise for them, and we aren't able to match that. And that's before you add in Champions league, and the higher profile exposure of being at a 'megaclub'.
My only real criticism is that we've allowed this to happen all in one transfer window. Everton, who are the club closest to what I believe we could realistically achieve, sell1-2 per year. At some point Barkley will follow the same path as Rodwell, Rooney etc. but probably next season, perhaps with Coleman. And John Stoanes the season after.And to be fair, who else is left in their side that the big boys would want? We seem to have a much deeper vein of talent that the big boys want, and that's huge credit to our beloved club.
Obviously I'm nervous about the next season, but as a Saints, and generally a footy, fan, I can't wait to get back on it!!
Tony in Liberia has eloquently said what I was thinking. The bottom line, like it or not, is that if these players do well for us, and get in the spotlight, one of the big 6 will come along, and offer them 100k a week. It's just something we cannot and will not be able to pay. Simple as that. Yes, maybe they will sit on the bench, but they're still going to get that 100k, every week. Would any of us, if offered a job at a rival firm, on 3-4 times (maybe even5?) times more money? Even if we knew that maybe our current workmates were nicer, and that the projects at the new place wouldn't be as exciting, and we'd have more time stuck behind a desk, rather than out meeting clients or seeing the world? And I repeat, maybe FIVE TIMES MORE WAGES... Football teams make their money from TV, and sponsorship. Gate receipts are important, but no longer the key factor. Man Utd aren't able to pay top dollar because of the capacity of Old Trafford, but because they have a 750 million quid shirt sponsorship, and TV money from all over the world. These past few years we've invested in the long term future of the club, with a state of the art training facility. This will allow is to attract the very best youngsters, and we will continue to develop top class talent, as we have already been made famous for. However, until the day that we can pay these kids the fortunes on offer in Manchester,Liverpool or London, they will want to move on as soon as they have a good season. Les Reed was very naive to say there would be no fire sale, but in a way he was not wrong. We aren't selling because we have debts to clear, we're selling because these players now suddenly have fame, and agents know they can get a huge rise for them, and we aren't able to match that. And that's before you add in Champions league, and the higher profile exposure of being at a 'megaclub'. My only real criticism is that we've allowed this to happen all in one transfer window. Everton, who are the club closest to what I believe we could realistically achieve, sell1-2 per year. At some point Barkley will follow the same path as Rodwell, Rooney etc. but probably next season, perhaps with Coleman. And John Stoanes the season after.And to be fair, who else is left in their side that the big boys would want? We seem to have a much deeper vein of talent that the big boys want, and that's huge credit to our beloved club. Obviously I'm nervous about the next season, but as a Saints, and generally a footy, fan, I can't wait to get back on it!! BracknellSaint
  • Score: 17

8:02am Sat 26 Jul 14

Saint_rob says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Best article I have ever read on this site.
People are slating RK, but his main job is to improve
The commercial side of the business, if he get that income up
Then that helps our wage bill to rise.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Best article I have ever read on this site. People are slating RK, but his main job is to improve The commercial side of the business, if he get that income up Then that helps our wage bill to rise. Saint_rob
  • Score: 1

8:05am Sat 26 Jul 14

Clever Dick says...

bbb001 wrote:
Has Baldrick been appointed to the board as this might be part of a really cunning plan
We tried to ge him but unfortunately we found out he's been working for Poopey for quite some time now.
[quote][p][bold]bbb001[/bold] wrote: Has Baldrick been appointed to the board as this might be part of a really cunning plan[/p][/quote]We tried to ge him but unfortunately we found out he's been working for Poopey for quite some time now. Clever Dick
  • Score: 3

8:09am Sat 26 Jul 14

cpnhadock says...

I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though!

However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate.

As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school.

Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;)

Coyr&ws
I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though! However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate. As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school. Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;) Coyr&ws cpnhadock
  • Score: 3

8:18am Sat 26 Jul 14

Georgethepie says...

And to think I nearly purchased a season ticket. Thank god I didn't the owners is just greedy.
Still on the plus side I'm after some turf to finish my lawn think I might approach KL with a cheeky bid for some of SMS pitch after all she's sold everything else.
This whole situation is so short sighted. You obtain millions from sky and you sell your top players obtaining more millions. But KL what happens when we get relegated. Answer all those millions get eaten into which can only lead us to believe this is a fire sale and your leaving too.

Football is ruined, England are ruined, and sadly Saints are going the same way under this bunch of clowns
And to think I nearly purchased a season ticket. Thank god I didn't the owners is just greedy. Still on the plus side I'm after some turf to finish my lawn think I might approach KL with a cheeky bid for some of SMS pitch after all she's sold everything else. This whole situation is so short sighted. You obtain millions from sky and you sell your top players obtaining more millions. But KL what happens when we get relegated. Answer all those millions get eaten into which can only lead us to believe this is a fire sale and your leaving too. Football is ruined, England are ruined, and sadly Saints are going the same way under this bunch of clowns Georgethepie
  • Score: 2

8:19am Sat 26 Jul 14

Sheffieldsaint says...

Will the last one out please turn off the lights!
Will the last one out please turn off the lights! Sheffieldsaint
  • Score: 0

8:19am Sat 26 Jul 14

freeroamer says...

I want to type more but im speechless, frustrated, angry and utterly depressed. This summer has been a footballing disaster. Yes we are rich, but we are proof that money alone doesn't buy you happiness. I have lost all faith in our owners. Markus has been betrayed, and must be turning in his grave now :-(
I want to type more but im speechless, frustrated, angry and utterly depressed. This summer has been a footballing disaster. Yes we are rich, but we are proof that money alone doesn't buy you happiness. I have lost all faith in our owners. Markus has been betrayed, and must be turning in his grave now :-( freeroamer
  • Score: 3

8:20am Sat 26 Jul 14

one in the crowd says...

Swissowned wrote:
This is the last straw and has tempted me to make a rare comment.

This is a joke, an absolute joke. I'm seriously hacked off even though I expected some of our talent to be leaving in the summer. But this has now gone too far. He's under contract until 2017 so just say "no." I don't care if they come back with 30, 35 or 40 million. Enough is enough.

At this rate, for the opening game of the season, the Liverpool first eleven will be lining up at anfield against a huge sack of cash.
:(

My only personal consolation is that this justifies my difficult decision not to renew my season ticket this year.
That's why the club invited fans to renew it earlier than usual, without giving any reason for their change in renewal date.
[quote][p][bold]Swissowned[/bold] wrote: This is the last straw and has tempted me to make a rare comment. This is a joke, an absolute joke. I'm seriously hacked off even though I expected some of our talent to be leaving in the summer. But this has now gone too far. He's under contract until 2017 so just say "no." I don't care if they come back with 30, 35 or 40 million. Enough is enough. At this rate, for the opening game of the season, the Liverpool first eleven will be lining up at anfield against a huge sack of cash. :( My only personal consolation is that this justifies my difficult decision not to renew my season ticket this year.[/p][/quote]That's why the club invited fans to renew it earlier than usual, without giving any reason for their change in renewal date. one in the crowd
  • Score: 2

8:20am Sat 26 Jul 14

AB1958 says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
I agree....the powers that be only care about the top 4 clubs - the FA, The media, Sky TV etc etc. It will just get worse and worse sadly with more money going into Football.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]I agree....the powers that be only care about the top 4 clubs - the FA, The media, Sky TV etc etc. It will just get worse and worse sadly with more money going into Football. AB1958
  • Score: 5

8:25am Sat 26 Jul 14

sparky130a says...

Just woke up to this.

I suspect i've just woken up to something far worse in the longterm..
Just woke up to this. I suspect i've just woken up to something far worse in the longterm.. sparky130a
  • Score: 2

8:28am Sat 26 Jul 14

Prit says...

All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????
All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ??????? Prit
  • Score: 2

8:28am Sat 26 Jul 14

Chapperall says...

cpnhadock wrote:
I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though!

However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate.

As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school.

Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;)

Coyr&ws
Hard ball until the figure goes up and then they will sell. I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players! There is no evidence to suggest that we are seeking more players or even in the market only giving stupid offers of £3m for Forster.
I am also a true supporter but just because you see things going pear shaped and have your say you are called a moaner by the happy clappers and hand wringers who appear to be happy in seeing our club taken apart.
They can't even get the new shirts right as they are all too small.
Get a grip les Reid and give the supporters something to start believing again. Those who watched the match with Bournemouth last night, it wasn't very convincing yes Targett did well but the defence looked suspect. We need a replacement for Lovren immediately, and if Spider is sold I dread to think!
[quote][p][bold]cpnhadock[/bold] wrote: I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though! However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate. As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school. Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;) Coyr&ws[/p][/quote]Hard ball until the figure goes up and then they will sell. I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players! There is no evidence to suggest that we are seeking more players or even in the market only giving stupid offers of £3m for Forster. I am also a true supporter but just because you see things going pear shaped and have your say you are called a moaner by the happy clappers and hand wringers who appear to be happy in seeing our club taken apart. They can't even get the new shirts right as they are all too small. Get a grip les Reid and give the supporters something to start believing again. Those who watched the match with Bournemouth last night, it wasn't very convincing yes Targett did well but the defence looked suspect. We need a replacement for Lovren immediately, and if Spider is sold I dread to think! Chapperall
  • Score: 4

8:33am Sat 26 Jul 14

Georgethepie says...

FA take note...... Question why is the England national side so bad.
Answer. Because the big clubs buy all the young talent from greedy owners of smaller clubs
Thus the talent fails to develop due to lack of time, investment and never playing but if it helps blame all foreign players and keep your heads in the sand.
Could take 10 years or more to repair the damage being done at St Mary's KL please leave now and take your team of muppets with you
FA take note...... Question why is the England national side so bad. Answer. Because the big clubs buy all the young talent from greedy owners of smaller clubs Thus the talent fails to develop due to lack of time, investment and never playing but if it helps blame all foreign players and keep your heads in the sand. Could take 10 years or more to repair the damage being done at St Mary's KL please leave now and take your team of muppets with you Georgethepie
  • Score: 9

8:40am Sat 26 Jul 14

Mister E says...

Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Great post!
Well thought out and very well written. There may be those that disagree (I don't), but you can't argue with your sincerity!
On the filling of a bigger stadium, it's a kind chicken and egg situation. The better the team perform, the more people are interested. I remember in the past having this discussion with mates when we were still at the Dell. Ok it was a small stadium, but the "theory" still holds true.
We were the only premier league club on the south coast with a huge catchment area. When we were doing well more people wanted to come from far and wide. Ok some were interested in seeing your Man U's etc, but, some were so entertained/impresse
d with Saints they wanted to come more often!
I believe the same would be true today.
[quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Great post! Well thought out and very well written. There may be those that disagree (I don't), but you can't argue with your sincerity! On the filling of a bigger stadium, it's a kind chicken and egg situation. The better the team perform, the more people are interested. I remember in the past having this discussion with mates when we were still at the Dell. Ok it was a small stadium, but the "theory" still holds true. We were the only premier league club on the south coast with a huge catchment area. When we were doing well more people wanted to come from far and wide. Ok some were interested in seeing your Man U's etc, but, some were so entertained/impresse d with Saints they wanted to come more often! I believe the same would be true today. Mister E
  • Score: 5

8:40am Sat 26 Jul 14

Clever Dick says...

one in the crowd wrote:
If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark.

One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons.

It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge.
It also doesnt take a genius to work out that if not one single fan bought a season ticket it would make very little difference to the club finances, considering the huge income from SKY, player sales etc.For example the sale of LS raised more than the total gate receipts for the season. So your argument is nothing but cr@p . No owner would deliberately risk relegation with the huge financial repurcussions that go with it. The problem we have is a direct effect of a successful season and the players thinking they are better than they really are as a result. Our success was based on a team ethic which they simply wont find at the "big time wannabe" clubs. That's why the board are cashing in on silly offers and taking clubs like Thievingskiverpool for a ride. And of course there is also the greed factor. What is disconcerting is the apparent lack of action bringing in replacements. I have no doubt this will be changing in the very near future.
[quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark. One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons. It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge.[/p][/quote]It also doesnt take a genius to work out that if not one single fan bought a season ticket it would make very little difference to the club finances, considering the huge income from SKY, player sales etc.For example the sale of LS raised more than the total gate receipts for the season. So your argument is nothing but cr@p . No owner would deliberately risk relegation with the huge financial repurcussions that go with it. The problem we have is a direct effect of a successful season and the players thinking they are better than they really are as a result. Our success was based on a team ethic which they simply wont find at the "big time wannabe" clubs. That's why the board are cashing in on silly offers and taking clubs like Thievingskiverpool for a ride. And of course there is also the greed factor. What is disconcerting is the apparent lack of action bringing in replacements. I have no doubt this will be changing in the very near future. Clever Dick
  • Score: 7

8:42am Sat 26 Jul 14

saintforever says...

can i ask for a refund on my season ticket - surely i could ask under the sale of goods act as what i was buying no longer exists - when i bought it we had a good chance of doing the same as last season with a great group of players - now we have sold lots of those players and only replaced with 2 - i think we will be lucky to avoid bottom 6
can i ask for a refund on my season ticket - surely i could ask under the sale of goods act as what i was buying no longer exists - when i bought it we had a good chance of doing the same as last season with a great group of players - now we have sold lots of those players and only replaced with 2 - i think we will be lucky to avoid bottom 6 saintforever
  • Score: 1

8:42am Sat 26 Jul 14

lambo83 says...

I fail to see how anyone can put a positive spin on this with any credibility. Back to the dark days of total(y skint) Dutch football. Wtf is going on? Who's going to want to come to us now. What an embarrassment we are , how very saddening. Sack the board
I fail to see how anyone can put a positive spin on this with any credibility. Back to the dark days of total(y skint) Dutch football. Wtf is going on? Who's going to want to come to us now. What an embarrassment we are , how very saddening. Sack the board lambo83
  • Score: 2

8:44am Sat 26 Jul 14

Zippo1 says...

cpnhadock wrote:
I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though!

However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate.

As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school.

Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;)

Coyr&ws
It's clear to see now why 15 million has been spent on the academy, Saints are purely a supplier of talent to the whole of the premier leauge.
Last season showed what the potential would be if you could keep them together but it will not happen. The lure of the big clubs and the agents involvements have created the situation where the board cannot and will not turn down the huge profits available.
I like a lot of you love SFC but the club are looking at this from a pure business point of view, we better get used to it, because I believe it's our future now.
It will be stay in the premiership (just) ,,sign relatively cheap unknown talent from abroad and hope to get lucky.
I don't like it but I fear this is it now. What do we do ? Keep ranting? Change teams, support Liverhampton, or become a Skate. ?
We have no choice but to get behind the team, and whoever wants to pull on a Saints shirt and get behind RK cos he might not have been told the whole story either!!!!! COYR
[quote][p][bold]cpnhadock[/bold] wrote: I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though! However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate. As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school. Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;) Coyr&ws[/p][/quote]It's clear to see now why 15 million has been spent on the academy, Saints are purely a supplier of talent to the whole of the premier leauge. Last season showed what the potential would be if you could keep them together but it will not happen. The lure of the big clubs and the agents involvements have created the situation where the board cannot and will not turn down the huge profits available. I like a lot of you love SFC but the club are looking at this from a pure business point of view, we better get used to it, because I believe it's our future now. It will be stay in the premiership (just) ,,sign relatively cheap unknown talent from abroad and hope to get lucky. I don't like it but I fear this is it now. What do we do ? Keep ranting? Change teams, support Liverhampton, or become a Skate. ? We have no choice but to get behind the team, and whoever wants to pull on a Saints shirt and get behind RK cos he might not have been told the whole story either!!!!! COYR Zippo1
  • Score: 1

8:44am Sat 26 Jul 14

TakingLeTiss says...

Enough is enough. I am not paying any more money to help us develop players for the likes of Liverpool, Man Utd and Arsenal. Seriously, until we take a stand and stop paying money nothing will happen, as the last round of "reassurances" from Reed prove. If the club does seriously need the money because we are actually in dire financial straits it needs to come clean now because putting up a smoke screen just winds people up.

What is the point of it all?
Enough is enough. I am not paying any more money to help us develop players for the likes of Liverpool, Man Utd and Arsenal. Seriously, until we take a stand and stop paying money nothing will happen, as the last round of "reassurances" from Reed prove. If the club does seriously need the money because we are actually in dire financial straits it needs to come clean now because putting up a smoke screen just winds people up. What is the point of it all? TakingLeTiss
  • Score: 7

8:44am Sat 26 Jul 14

InCortesewetrust says...

Is there any wonder why Cortese left? He wasn't going to be part of this, we are being rapped from behind with A OBSCENELY COLOSSAL elephant size ****!, and the saints faithful are supposed to take it like dale Winton . yes please les and kat more please, shniderlin next, too good a offer to turn down, I'm sure your get at least £10 for targett if you put the word out!
Is there any wonder why Cortese left? He wasn't going to be part of this, we are being rapped from behind with A OBSCENELY COLOSSAL elephant size ****!, and the saints faithful are supposed to take it like dale Winton . yes please les and kat more please, shniderlin next, too good a offer to turn down, I'm sure your get at least £10 for targett if you put the word out! InCortesewetrust
  • Score: 4

8:45am Sat 26 Jul 14

WORZEL says...

SAINTS ARE NOW THE BOOKIES FAVOURITE FOR RELEGATION

EXPECTED ONE OR TWO TO GO - BUT THIS IS LUDICROUS - SHOULD HAVE SAVED MYSELF £650 AND GOT A SEASON TICKET FOR EASTLEIGH - WILL SPEAK TO MY SOLICITOR TO SEE ABOUT A REFUND.
SAINTS ARE NOW THE BOOKIES FAVOURITE FOR RELEGATION EXPECTED ONE OR TWO TO GO - BUT THIS IS LUDICROUS - SHOULD HAVE SAVED MYSELF £650 AND GOT A SEASON TICKET FOR EASTLEIGH - WILL SPEAK TO MY SOLICITOR TO SEE ABOUT A REFUND. WORZEL
  • Score: 2

8:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

jls217 says...

MccSaint wrote:
I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.
It's not a case of having to sell or even wanting to sell - agents, players and clubs with huge financial clout decide they want and we can then make a choice to keep a player who will refuse to play or train, will refuse to honour their contract, will spread the poison throughout the club (seen too much of that in recent months, or accept the ridiculous amounts of money being flashed about. Rambo must be wondering what the hell he's walked into. I suspect the same thing will happen at the end of this season as our new faces make a reputation for themselves and the agents will get busy again.Until we can afford 100k wages this is our future. Every now and again it makes me wish I'd never walked into the Dell all those years ago and got smitten with an ailment there is no cure for - I just love football and the club - Like I said wish I didn't but can't seem to help it.
[quote][p][bold]MccSaint[/bold] wrote: I thought we had turned a corner as a club, no longer having to sell. But i think we've actually gone backwards, we used to sell one or two players a season, now it seems a large chunk of the team will be gone. Guess my trust must be with our new great manager, but his task it getting greater by the day.[/p][/quote]It's not a case of having to sell or even wanting to sell - agents, players and clubs with huge financial clout decide they want and we can then make a choice to keep a player who will refuse to play or train, will refuse to honour their contract, will spread the poison throughout the club (seen too much of that in recent months, or accept the ridiculous amounts of money being flashed about. Rambo must be wondering what the hell he's walked into. I suspect the same thing will happen at the end of this season as our new faces make a reputation for themselves and the agents will get busy again.Until we can afford 100k wages this is our future. Every now and again it makes me wish I'd never walked into the Dell all those years ago and got smitten with an ailment there is no cure for - I just love football and the club - Like I said wish I didn't but can't seem to help it. jls217
  • Score: 3

8:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

cotswoldsaint says...

Unf***ingbelievable! It appears we've been fed a pack of lies. Still, it is true to say we're not a selling club we're THE selling club!
Unf***ingbelievable! It appears we've been fed a pack of lies. Still, it is true to say we're not a selling club we're THE selling club! cotswoldsaint
  • Score: 5

8:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

InCortesewetrust says...

InCortesewetrust wrote:
Is there any wonder why Cortese left? He wasn't going to be part of this, we are being rapped from behind with A OBSCENELY COLOSSAL elephant size ****!, and the saints faithful are supposed to take it like dale Winton . yes please les and kat more please, shniderlin next, too good a offer to turn down, I'm sure your get at least £10 for targett if you put the word out!
£10m
[quote][p][bold]InCortesewetrust[/bold] wrote: Is there any wonder why Cortese left? He wasn't going to be part of this, we are being rapped from behind with A OBSCENELY COLOSSAL elephant size ****!, and the saints faithful are supposed to take it like dale Winton . yes please les and kat more please, shniderlin next, too good a offer to turn down, I'm sure your get at least £10 for targett if you put the word out![/p][/quote]£10m InCortesewetrust
  • Score: -3

8:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

sparky130a says...

Prit wrote:
All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????
I never thought i'd agree...

But i now do. If only by virtue of the deafening silence. The board clearly don't understand it's not just what you do or don't do. It's the perception.

And on that basis we're up the proverbial...
[quote][p][bold]Prit[/bold] wrote: All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????[/p][/quote]I never thought i'd agree... But i now do. If only by virtue of the deafening silence. The board clearly don't understand it's not just what you do or don't do. It's the perception. And on that basis we're up the proverbial... sparky130a
  • Score: 2

8:53am Sat 26 Jul 14

Mister E says...

Prit wrote:
All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????
Ummm, sell all your assets, then try and sell your club?
Without your assets the club is less attractive, so, far fewer potential buyers! Those potential buyers would pay you far, far less than you would have got by selling your club with all your assets!
The Board may be many things, but they ain't stupid!!
[quote][p][bold]Prit[/bold] wrote: All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????[/p][/quote]Ummm, sell all your assets, then try and sell your club? Without your assets the club is less attractive, so, far fewer potential buyers! Those potential buyers would pay you far, far less than you would have got by selling your club with all your assets! The Board may be many things, but they ain't stupid!! Mister E
  • Score: 2

8:55am Sat 26 Jul 14

Emsworthsaint says...

The startling truth is that :

1. That xyz has signed a new 3-4 year contract means he is 'passing time' waiting for his agent to get him a better wage packet.

2. Never before has the whole game been about how much money can be earned in players wages.

3. Clubs below 6th place will be prey because they do not/will not pay eye watering wages.

4. Clubs who do the 'right thing' right, develop academies and are not prepared or cannot pay those wages will loose their players via agents who see great riches for themselves - all unknown faces/names to most of us.

5. We have to accept that players will go even if it means they move from being 'big fishes' in small ponds to squad players in big 'top 6' clubs because it's because they have doubled or trebled their wages.

6. So to sum up, Saints 2013/2014 success will lead to an 'ordinary' (at best) 2014/2015 season having banked 80 million (and no debt)

7. Football has totally changed. The FA and Club Administrators are powerless and cannot anything but watch.
The startling truth is that : 1. That xyz has signed a new 3-4 year contract means he is 'passing time' waiting for his agent to get him a better wage packet. 2. Never before has the whole game been about how much money can be earned in players wages. 3. Clubs below 6th place will be prey because they do not/will not pay eye watering wages. 4. Clubs who do the 'right thing' right, develop academies and are not prepared or cannot pay those wages will loose their players via agents who see great riches for themselves - all unknown faces/names to most of us. 5. We have to accept that players will go even if it means they move from being 'big fishes' in small ponds to squad players in big 'top 6' clubs because it's because they have doubled or trebled their wages. 6. So to sum up, Saints 2013/2014 success will lead to an 'ordinary' (at best) 2014/2015 season having banked 80 million (and no debt) 7. Football has totally changed. The FA and Club Administrators are powerless and cannot anything but watch. Emsworthsaint
  • Score: 6

8:57am Sat 26 Jul 14

The saints 74 says...

Positively4thStreet wrote:
Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired!
Rip Southampton fc.
Supported saints for 40 years, this is surely the most unique and baffling close season I've known.
The board desperately need to make a statement on what the hell is going on.
[quote][p][bold]Positively4thStreet[/bold] wrote: Have my say?...Sorry,I'm too tired![/p][/quote]Rip Southampton fc. Supported saints for 40 years, this is surely the most unique and baffling close season I've known. The board desperately need to make a statement on what the hell is going on. The saints 74
  • Score: 5

8:58am Sat 26 Jul 14

truelysaints says...

Looks like he next thing we will hear is that the club will be sold to a new owner with KL and the board having pocketed a nice fat profit from selling off the family jewels. I have been patient in giving my verdict on the board ad owner but now fell the time has come to give it. A BUNCH OF CARPET BAGGERS. Its time, we the supporters register our displeasure in the way OUR club is being torn to shreds by not buying the season tickets, and/or boycotting home games
Looks like he next thing we will hear is that the club will be sold to a new owner with KL and the board having pocketed a nice fat profit from selling off the family jewels. I have been patient in giving my verdict on the board ad owner but now fell the time has come to give it. A BUNCH OF CARPET BAGGERS. Its time, we the supporters register our displeasure in the way OUR club is being torn to shreds by not buying the season tickets, and/or boycotting home games truelysaints
  • Score: 0

9:00am Sat 26 Jul 14

jls217 says...

BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website.
This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope.

Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.
[quote][p][bold]BarnetSaint[/bold] wrote: Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful.[/p][/quote]Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website. This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope. Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan. jls217
  • Score: -2

9:02am Sat 26 Jul 14

mickey01 says...

The more you lot pay over the odds for the shirts and line their pockets the more angry i get when you call them names for doing some business !! You cant have it both ways you protest with your voice but not with your wallets which would hit them harder buying the family of 4 etc all shirts is what they love . There are no football loving men/women running clubs in the premier league only money loving men. if you want real football passion then look to the leagues below
The more you lot pay over the odds for the shirts and line their pockets the more angry i get when you call them names for doing some business !! You cant have it both ways you protest with your voice but not with your wallets which would hit them harder buying the family of 4 etc all shirts is what they love . There are no football loving men/women running clubs in the premier league only money loving men. if you want real football passion then look to the leagues below mickey01
  • Score: 8

9:03am Sat 26 Jul 14

one in the crowd says...

Clever Dick wrote:
one in the crowd wrote:
If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark.

One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons.

It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge.
It also doesnt take a genius to work out that if not one single fan bought a season ticket it would make very little difference to the club finances, considering the huge income from SKY, player sales etc.For example the sale of LS raised more than the total gate receipts for the season. So your argument is nothing but cr@p . No owner would deliberately risk relegation with the huge financial repurcussions that go with it. The problem we have is a direct effect of a successful season and the players thinking they are better than they really are as a result. Our success was based on a team ethic which they simply wont find at the "big time wannabe" clubs. That's why the board are cashing in on silly offers and taking clubs like Thievingskiverpool for a ride. And of course there is also the greed factor. What is disconcerting is the apparent lack of action bringing in replacements. I have no doubt this will be changing in the very near future.
You may think your a " CLEVER DICK " , but considering the facts that are emerging you're opinions on this matter are DEFINITELY in the minority.
Even the staunchest fans are beginning to see through the smokescreen put up by the club.

I would say that you are no " CLEVER DICK " , you are just completely blind to all that is happening around you, please don't forget to switch off the light when you leave.
[quote][p][bold]Clever Dick[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]one in the crowd[/bold] wrote: If you where to take in what I said about what is happening at Saint's, you must surely see that fans who were asked to renew season tickets early have been taken for a ride by a management that is keeping them completely in the dark. One doesn't need to be a genius to work out that there is something seriously wrong within the administration of Saint's, I don't know of any other club that has had the kind of trouble Saint's have had between it's star players and management, after Saint's have had one of their best ever seasons. It isn't fair to put all the blame on Liverpool, they are only securing their own future ambitions and success as a football club, something that sadly Saint's management seems to ignore for it's own fans. Believe me something is very wrong behind the scenes at your club, and in time the truth might emerge.[/p][/quote]It also doesnt take a genius to work out that if not one single fan bought a season ticket it would make very little difference to the club finances, considering the huge income from SKY, player sales etc.For example the sale of LS raised more than the total gate receipts for the season. So your argument is nothing but cr@p . No owner would deliberately risk relegation with the huge financial repurcussions that go with it. The problem we have is a direct effect of a successful season and the players thinking they are better than they really are as a result. Our success was based on a team ethic which they simply wont find at the "big time wannabe" clubs. That's why the board are cashing in on silly offers and taking clubs like Thievingskiverpool for a ride. And of course there is also the greed factor. What is disconcerting is the apparent lack of action bringing in replacements. I have no doubt this will be changing in the very near future.[/p][/quote]You may think your a " CLEVER DICK " , but considering the facts that are emerging you're opinions on this matter are DEFINITELY in the minority. Even the staunchest fans are beginning to see through the smokescreen put up by the club. I would say that you are no " CLEVER DICK " , you are just completely blind to all that is happening around you, please don't forget to switch off the light when you leave. one in the crowd
  • Score: -1

9:07am Sat 26 Jul 14

Emsworthsaint says...

jls217 wrote:
BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website.
This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope.

Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.
Well said. See my thoughts above yours
[quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BarnetSaint[/bold] wrote: Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful.[/p][/quote]Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website. This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope. Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.[/p][/quote]Well said. See my thoughts above yours Emsworthsaint
  • Score: 3

9:09am Sat 26 Jul 14

chapelsaint says...

Although I am a season ticket holder and have been a supporter since the late 1950's, I believe that it is now time for the fans to take a stand. The first two home games (West Brom and Newcastle) will be the first opportunities to do anything positive, and by that I mean a complete "No Show". The board have got rid of the players so we, the supporters should show them what an empty stadium on match day looks like.
Although I am a season ticket holder and have been a supporter since the late 1950's, I believe that it is now time for the fans to take a stand. The first two home games (West Brom and Newcastle) will be the first opportunities to do anything positive, and by that I mean a complete "No Show". The board have got rid of the players so we, the supporters should show them what an empty stadium on match day looks like. chapelsaint
  • Score: 6

9:11am Sat 26 Jul 14

BarnetSaint says...

Hey DE.
Care to use your journalistic skills and getting the word from within the club.
Something.
Anything.
Or are they all hiding in a cupboard and waving a white flag in the air, or in the Swiss woman's case, counting out her juicy little profits.
Hey DE. Care to use your journalistic skills and getting the word from within the club. Something. Anything. Or are they all hiding in a cupboard and waving a white flag in the air, or in the Swiss woman's case, counting out her juicy little profits. BarnetSaint
  • Score: 8

9:12am Sat 26 Jul 14

saintbobby says...

So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood.

When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means.

I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth.
So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood. When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means. I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth. saintbobby
  • Score: 3

9:16am Sat 26 Jul 14

miltonarcher says...

Shambles, the silence from the club is deafening. And that is an insult to the supporters, remember them SFC?
Shambles, the silence from the club is deafening. And that is an insult to the supporters, remember them SFC? miltonarcher
  • Score: 7

9:18am Sat 26 Jul 14

jls217 says...

Saint 2701 wrote:
Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!!

Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going.

Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-(
Pathetic - Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe it was Cortese who somehow had a hand in the way this has all unfolded. I used to think he was the hand that would steer us to better things. How misled was I?
Just what did Katharina do wrong in your eyes?
If I came to your house and said to you put everything you own into my hands and I'll look after it all for you, so you don't have to worry about anything - I can guess what your answer would be.
If I then threw my dolly out and started making demands and issuing threats because I couldn't get you do to what I wanted - I'm guessing you'd run me off your property with a warning not to return. (and maybe with a scar or two to remind me not to return)
Well that, simplified is what Cortese did. No surprise to me she wouldn't let him spend all her money - you wouldn't dream of it so why should she. She hasn't made these players leave. Their agents, their own ambition, their egos, their lack of professionalism in adhering to their contracts, their lack of feeling about the club in the same way you and I do, their desire to earn half as much again as Saints could afford to pay them - all those things made them want to move on. All anyone involved in this club could do was make sure whoever wanted them paid a heavy price - and in that the management have been pretty successful. Not sure whether Freddie is the man to lead us into calmer waters or not - he has to be given the chance and Rambo needs years to put the ship back on the right course, one thing I am certain of is that there is no room for Cortese back here ever again. If he didn't start this mess, he probably could have stopped it but chose not to and maybe even chose to make it worse if he could - guess we'll never know for sure. Onwards and upwards 2701 and if you're going to be a sniper mate please make sure you're aiming at the right targets. Ask anyone who's been in the military - there is nothing worse than poorly aimed ammo going off around you - no such thing as friendly fire, if it's close to you it's downright scary and can have dire consequences. Please make that connection with what you're saying even if you mean well when you open fire.
A great season is coming our way.
[quote][p][bold]Saint 2701[/bold] wrote: Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!! Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going. Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-([/p][/quote]Pathetic - Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe it was Cortese who somehow had a hand in the way this has all unfolded. I used to think he was the hand that would steer us to better things. How misled was I? Just what did Katharina do wrong in your eyes? If I came to your house and said to you put everything you own into my hands and I'll look after it all for you, so you don't have to worry about anything - I can guess what your answer would be. If I then threw my dolly out and started making demands and issuing threats because I couldn't get you do to what I wanted - I'm guessing you'd run me off your property with a warning not to return. (and maybe with a scar or two to remind me not to return) Well that, simplified is what Cortese did. No surprise to me she wouldn't let him spend all her money - you wouldn't dream of it so why should she. She hasn't made these players leave. Their agents, their own ambition, their egos, their lack of professionalism in adhering to their contracts, their lack of feeling about the club in the same way you and I do, their desire to earn half as much again as Saints could afford to pay them - all those things made them want to move on. All anyone involved in this club could do was make sure whoever wanted them paid a heavy price - and in that the management have been pretty successful. Not sure whether Freddie is the man to lead us into calmer waters or not - he has to be given the chance and Rambo needs years to put the ship back on the right course, one thing I am certain of is that there is no room for Cortese back here ever again. If he didn't start this mess, he probably could have stopped it but chose not to and maybe even chose to make it worse if he could - guess we'll never know for sure. Onwards and upwards 2701 and if you're going to be a sniper mate please make sure you're aiming at the right targets. Ask anyone who's been in the military - there is nothing worse than poorly aimed ammo going off around you - no such thing as friendly fire, if it's close to you it's downright scary and can have dire consequences. Please make that connection with what you're saying even if you mean well when you open fire. A great season is coming our way. jls217
  • Score: 4

9:19am Sat 26 Jul 14

warrens 76 says...

I have said it before and I will say it again and again…SFC have always acted like a small prvoincial club and as such we are treated as a stepping stone by EVERYONE…players, agents, managers, etc. all the plastic fans in the south could fill our stadium 10X over but we do not have the 'appeal' the vibe, the sense of belonging…

If Southampton took a 10 year view of creating a southern identity, loyalty, if a stadium is built or expanded to 45000+ and the overriding ambition is to fill it for all future generations then and only then would we have a counterpoint to big 6 wages…a) because we could narrow the wages gap and b) give kids, academy players etc a sense of 'belonging'…..

It says much about the shallow instant gratification aspect of life today that most Southern kids assosciate themselves with a club they could not find on a map….I would start at this point a work forwards…

A super stadium and consistent southern based marketing would cost no more per year than the money wasted on an expensive failure every season or two….this approach is at least guaranteed to bring results.

We need to market the brand properly throughout the south, identity is the key and a temple to that identity is vital.

The club by operating a fan policy mirroring it's your policy 'get em young' will reap as much as £20 million a year more in ticket sales shirt sales, merchandising , etc in time…this is the ONLY way to deal with our future sensibly...
I have said it before and I will say it again and again…SFC have always acted like a small prvoincial club and as such we are treated as a stepping stone by EVERYONE…players, agents, managers, etc. all the plastic fans in the south could fill our stadium 10X over but we do not have the 'appeal' the vibe, the sense of belonging… If Southampton took a 10 year view of creating a southern identity, loyalty, if a stadium is built or expanded to 45000+ and the overriding ambition is to fill it for all future generations then and only then would we have a counterpoint to big 6 wages…a) because we could narrow the wages gap and b) give kids, academy players etc a sense of 'belonging'….. It says much about the shallow instant gratification aspect of life today that most Southern kids assosciate themselves with a club they could not find on a map….I would start at this point a work forwards… A super stadium and consistent southern based marketing would cost no more per year than the money wasted on an expensive failure every season or two….this approach is at least guaranteed to bring results. We need to market the brand properly throughout the south, identity is the key and a temple to that identity is vital. The club by operating a fan policy mirroring it's your policy 'get em young' will reap as much as £20 million a year more in ticket sales shirt sales, merchandising , etc in time…this is the ONLY way to deal with our future sensibly... warrens 76
  • Score: 9

9:21am Sat 26 Jul 14

Simmo13 says...

chapelsaint wrote:
Although I am a season ticket holder and have been a supporter since the late 1950's, I believe that it is now time for the fans to take a stand. The first two home games (West Brom and Newcastle) will be the first opportunities to do anything positive, and by that I mean a complete "No Show". The board have got rid of the players so we, the supporters should show them what an empty stadium on match day looks like.
I totally agree with you this Les Reed and that Canadian should be held accountable for destroying what they have done to our club those that think it is onwards and upwards are talking out the back of their heads.
I hate to say but if I could get my season ticket money back I would because I have been conned and for those that come on here and defend what is happening please tell me what quality players will want to join us in this situation it's becoming totally embarrassing now all round total destruction this.
[quote][p][bold]chapelsaint[/bold] wrote: Although I am a season ticket holder and have been a supporter since the late 1950's, I believe that it is now time for the fans to take a stand. The first two home games (West Brom and Newcastle) will be the first opportunities to do anything positive, and by that I mean a complete "No Show". The board have got rid of the players so we, the supporters should show them what an empty stadium on match day looks like.[/p][/quote]I totally agree with you this Les Reed and that Canadian should be held accountable for destroying what they have done to our club those that think it is onwards and upwards are talking out the back of their heads. I hate to say but if I could get my season ticket money back I would because I have been conned and for those that come on here and defend what is happening please tell me what quality players will want to join us in this situation it's becoming totally embarrassing now all round total destruction this. Simmo13
  • Score: 3

9:22am Sat 26 Jul 14

miltonarcher says...

FFS! SFC is becoming a joke, we are just a feeder club. Don't talk to me about this being good business, we need a strong squad, Clyne gets injured then what?
FFS! SFC is becoming a joke, we are just a feeder club. Don't talk to me about this being good business, we need a strong squad, Clyne gets injured then what? miltonarcher
  • Score: 6

9:26am Sat 26 Jul 14

saintmac says...

Go to St Marys and protest - phone the Club - write to the Club.We want this inept Board to resign and a statement of intent from Ms Liebherr.
Go to St Marys and protest - phone the Club - write to the Club.We want this inept Board to resign and a statement of intent from Ms Liebherr. saintmac
  • Score: 8

9:26am Sat 26 Jul 14

andy newbury says...

to say i am up[set does not even go any where near what i am felling at present, callum chambers is as the very least as good a player as luke shaw and i was hoping he would be left alone to develop into such. what the hell is going on!! enough is enough, how can we ever expect to keep our youngsters after the debacle that appears to be going on. last year osvaldo got shipped out because he upset the apple cart at st mary,s, THERE IS NO APPLE CART LEFT. get your act together please and sort this mess out ,the management need to stop this move as i am sure the anger and frustration that is now about WILL come back and bite them. i feel cheated at present as i have followed ed the saints through thick and thin since the early 60,s. i wouldn,t buy a season ticket at one stage because of rupert lowe and although a season ticket holder since his departure, it makes you wonder why i should bother now. our new owner i think made a mistake over sacking nicole cortese as i strongly believe he would have stood firmly against what is happening at present. the present management is at present to weak or being wrongly directed to achieve what we have been lead to was the way foreward. we must manage to keep our developed young team or end up with a load of journey players once again. we need good experienced players to play along side our youngsters, i am sure we have the wright manager to do that at present BUT we need not to keep on selling!! why can we not convince them they are in the wright place at saints, what is wrong, something is, sort it out or we will soon be back in div one once again, and quite frankly i enjoyed the games there although i have no wish to go back to that senario. football is a form of entertainment or supposed to be , there is no entertainment in following the saints at the moment. whwn we started under makus in league 1 we never even had a proper back 4 bit we survived and moved on ,we won,t be able to do this in the premier league. we need stability at present and look to leaders to show us the way, THEY ARE LETTING US ,THE SUPPORTERS DOWN BIG TIME AT PRESENT IF THEY CANNOT OR WILL NOT STOP THIS FIRE SALE OF PLAYERS. i will always support the saints but if this keeps on it may be at a distance . up the SAINTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!
to say i am up[set does not even go any where near what i am felling at present, callum chambers is as the very least as good a player as luke shaw and i was hoping he would be left alone to develop into such. what the hell is going on!! enough is enough, how can we ever expect to keep our youngsters after the debacle that appears to be going on. last year osvaldo got shipped out because he upset the apple cart at st mary,s, THERE IS NO APPLE CART LEFT. get your act together please and sort this mess out ,the management need to stop this move as i am sure the anger and frustration that is now about WILL come back and bite them. i feel cheated at present as i have followed ed the saints through thick and thin since the early 60,s. i wouldn,t buy a season ticket at one stage because of rupert lowe and although a season ticket holder since his departure, it makes you wonder why i should bother now. our new owner i think made a mistake over sacking nicole cortese as i strongly believe he would have stood firmly against what is happening at present. the present management is at present to weak or being wrongly directed to achieve what we have been lead to was the way foreward. we must manage to keep our developed young team or end up with a load of journey players once again. we need good experienced players to play along side our youngsters, i am sure we have the wright manager to do that at present BUT we need not to keep on selling!! why can we not convince them they are in the wright place at saints, what is wrong, something is, sort it out or we will soon be back in div one once again, and quite frankly i enjoyed the games there although i have no wish to go back to that senario. football is a form of entertainment or supposed to be , there is no entertainment in following the saints at the moment. whwn we started under makus in league 1 we never even had a proper back 4 bit we survived and moved on ,we won,t be able to do this in the premier league. we need stability at present and look to leaders to show us the way, THEY ARE LETTING US ,THE SUPPORTERS DOWN BIG TIME AT PRESENT IF THEY CANNOT OR WILL NOT STOP THIS FIRE SALE OF PLAYERS. i will always support the saints but if this keeps on it may be at a distance . up the SAINTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!!!! andy newbury
  • Score: 5

9:28am Sat 26 Jul 14

Simmo13 says...

saintbobby wrote:
So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood.

When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means.

I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth.
Signings are you dreaming and how in the hell do you expect systems and knitting a team together takes we are a couple of weeks away most of the other sides have bought in what they want (our players and more) and we have bought two wise up please.
[quote][p][bold]saintbobby[/bold] wrote: So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood. When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means. I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth.[/p][/quote]Signings are you dreaming and how in the hell do you expect systems and knitting a team together takes we are a couple of weeks away most of the other sides have bought in what they want (our players and more) and we have bought two wise up please. Simmo13
  • Score: 3

9:28am Sat 26 Jul 14

Simmo13 says...

saintbobby wrote:
So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood.

When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means.

I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth.
Signings are you dreaming and how in the hell do you expect systems and knitting a team together takes we are a couple of weeks away most of the other sides have bought in what they want (our players and more) and we have bought two wise up please.
[quote][p][bold]saintbobby[/bold] wrote: So Lallana is out for 6 weeks due to a knee injury on the training ground. Bet it would not have happened at Staplewood. When the phrase "there's going to be a riot" was coined, I reckon it was because someone had a crystal ball and could see what was going to happen at St. Mary's this summer. Also, I now know what pig-sick means. I have said before there is still some time before we go to Anfield and some signings might be afoot. If they do not, then, as I joked last night, the coach driver knows the way to Bournemouth.[/p][/quote]Signings are you dreaming and how in the hell do you expect systems and knitting a team together takes we are a couple of weeks away most of the other sides have bought in what they want (our players and more) and we have bought two wise up please. Simmo13
  • Score: 2

9:29am Sat 26 Jul 14

Simmo13 says...

GET REED OUT HE IS USELESS
GET REED OUT HE IS USELESS Simmo13
  • Score: 9

9:32am Sat 26 Jul 14

St Forlife says...

Quite frankly if I can't wake up in the morning and thing Saints want to do the very best they can - then we have already achieved it - if 8th was our ambition then sod it I'd rather play golf on a saturday afternoon. In all my 44 years of watching Saints I always felt we tried to compete - without trying there's no point.

Having finished 8th we let the manager go and sell literally half the team. It's good business for the board - no one else - money grabbing selfish nasty pieces of work and nI for one will NOT boo Koeman if the results go against us this year - on the contrary I will cheer him

I will cheer hyim because if the results go bad the board will 'take action' and replace him when this is something brewed entirely by the board.

I have never felt so disollusioned with the game - even on the day we got relegated to League 1 nfrom the Championship - I always felt that we were a club in stress - this is pure greedy asset stripping
Quite frankly if I can't wake up in the morning and thing Saints want to do the very best they can - then we have already achieved it - if 8th was our ambition then sod it I'd rather play golf on a saturday afternoon. In all my 44 years of watching Saints I always felt we tried to compete - without trying there's no point. Having finished 8th we let the manager go and sell literally half the team. It's good business for the board - no one else - money grabbing selfish nasty pieces of work and nI for one will NOT boo Koeman if the results go against us this year - on the contrary I will cheer him I will cheer hyim because if the results go bad the board will 'take action' and replace him when this is something brewed entirely by the board. I have never felt so disollusioned with the game - even on the day we got relegated to League 1 nfrom the Championship - I always felt that we were a club in stress - this is pure greedy asset stripping St Forlife
  • Score: 3

9:34am Sat 26 Jul 14

bullsbags says...

Somebody better put a bullet proof screen around the directors box o wait a minute our no1 supporter won't be there next season,the fat cow has been given a season ticket for Anfield
Somebody better put a bullet proof screen around the directors box o wait a minute our no1 supporter won't be there next season,the fat cow has been given a season ticket for Anfield bullsbags
  • Score: -2

9:35am Sat 26 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

jls217 wrote:
BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website.
This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope.

Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.
....And you still refuse to lay the blame where it belongs UNBELIEVABLE!!!!
Les read and the board are responsible for this debacle, the buck stops at board level.
None of the players are to blame, none were offered improved contracts so they went. simple!!!!
""Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? """"" Too bl00dy right they did, wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
The meddling media... ffs, they got everything right, to be fair it was not difficult

JLS, when is the penny going to drop, you have been in denial all along, time to accept you were 100% wrong.
[quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BarnetSaint[/bold] wrote: Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful.[/p][/quote]Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website. This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope. Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.[/p][/quote]....And you still refuse to lay the blame where it belongs UNBELIEVABLE!!!! Les read and the board are responsible for this debacle, the buck stops at board level. None of the players are to blame, none were offered improved contracts so they went. simple!!!! ""Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? """"" Too bl00dy right they did, wake up and smell the coffee!!!! The meddling media... ffs, they got everything right, to be fair it was not difficult JLS, when is the penny going to drop, you have been in denial all along, time to accept you were 100% wrong. costa gaz
  • Score: 5

9:36am Sat 26 Jul 14

jls217 says...

costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............

. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out.
I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose.
What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them.
Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out. I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose. What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them. Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison jls217
  • Score: 7

9:41am Sat 26 Jul 14

The Rise of The Foot Soldier. says...

SFC are not even trying any more ... They know we need a list of players like an additional number one Keeper .. And then they put in a derisory offer to go through the motions and manipulate the media including DE and the fans ....

We have endured Judas MP and the want away players - but this is more sinister and makes no sense - and with stripping everything good from the playing squad and putting In a couple of token imports we are only heading one way.

If les reed or the board are at Brighton away - they are gonna get ripped to shreds ...

Weeks ago we protested about the goings on - to get eloquent words from posters like shareholder putting the ultimate positive spin on events.

Down the greasy pole we go to the Championship as bookies favourites .... Meanwhile Ralph Les and co are picking out huge salaries .....

Protest at the next game ..... SACK THE BOARD and get on the phone to the club - media outlets - and even mike O Callaghan ASAP

COYR+WS
SFC are not even trying any more ... They know we need a list of players like an additional number one Keeper .. And then they put in a derisory offer to go through the motions and manipulate the media including DE and the fans .... We have endured Judas MP and the want away players - but this is more sinister and makes no sense - and with stripping everything good from the playing squad and putting In a couple of token imports we are only heading one way. If les reed or the board are at Brighton away - they are gonna get ripped to shreds ... Weeks ago we protested about the goings on - to get eloquent words from posters like shareholder putting the ultimate positive spin on events. Down the greasy pole we go to the Championship as bookies favourites .... Meanwhile Ralph Les and co are picking out huge salaries ..... Protest at the next game ..... SACK THE BOARD and get on the phone to the club - media outlets - and even mike O Callaghan ASAP COYR+WS The Rise of The Foot Soldier.
  • Score: 2

9:42am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

BracknellSaint wrote:
Tony in Liberia has eloquently said what I was thinking.
The bottom line, like it or not, is that if these players do well for us, and get in the spotlight, one of the big 6 will come along, and offer them 100k a week. It's just something we cannot and will not be able to pay. Simple as that. Yes, maybe they will sit on the bench, but they're still going to get that 100k, every week.
Would any of us, if offered a job at a rival firm, on 3-4 times (maybe even5?) times more money? Even if we knew that maybe our current workmates were nicer, and that the projects at the new place wouldn't be as exciting, and we'd have more time stuck behind a desk, rather than out meeting clients or seeing the world? And I repeat, maybe FIVE TIMES MORE WAGES...
Football teams make their money from TV, and sponsorship. Gate receipts are important, but no longer the key factor.
Man Utd aren't able to pay top dollar because of the capacity of Old Trafford, but because they have a 750 million quid shirt sponsorship, and TV money from all over the world.
These past few years we've invested in the long term future of the club, with a state of the art training facility. This will allow is to attract the very best youngsters, and we will continue to develop top class talent, as we have already been made famous for. However, until the day that we can pay these kids the fortunes on offer in Manchester,Liverpool or London, they will want to move on as soon as they have a good season.
Les Reed was very naive to say there would be no fire sale, but in a way he was not wrong. We aren't selling because we have debts to clear, we're selling because these players now suddenly have fame, and agents know they can get a huge rise for them, and we aren't able to match that. And that's before you add in Champions league, and the higher profile exposure of being at a 'megaclub'.
My only real criticism is that we've allowed this to happen all in one transfer window. Everton, who are the club closest to what I believe we could realistically achieve, sell1-2 per year. At some point Barkley will follow the same path as Rodwell, Rooney etc. but probably next season, perhaps with Coleman. And John Stoanes the season after.And to be fair, who else is left in their side that the big boys would want? We seem to have a much deeper vein of talent that the big boys want, and that's huge credit to our beloved club.
Obviously I'm nervous about the next season, but as a Saints, and generally a footy, fan, I can't wait to get back on it!!
Everton have been in the top division for at least 80 years, so they 'dribble' players. We have been back for just two and last year we surprised everyone, that why it's a flood.
[quote][p][bold]BracknellSaint[/bold] wrote: Tony in Liberia has eloquently said what I was thinking. The bottom line, like it or not, is that if these players do well for us, and get in the spotlight, one of the big 6 will come along, and offer them 100k a week. It's just something we cannot and will not be able to pay. Simple as that. Yes, maybe they will sit on the bench, but they're still going to get that 100k, every week. Would any of us, if offered a job at a rival firm, on 3-4 times (maybe even5?) times more money? Even if we knew that maybe our current workmates were nicer, and that the projects at the new place wouldn't be as exciting, and we'd have more time stuck behind a desk, rather than out meeting clients or seeing the world? And I repeat, maybe FIVE TIMES MORE WAGES... Football teams make their money from TV, and sponsorship. Gate receipts are important, but no longer the key factor. Man Utd aren't able to pay top dollar because of the capacity of Old Trafford, but because they have a 750 million quid shirt sponsorship, and TV money from all over the world. These past few years we've invested in the long term future of the club, with a state of the art training facility. This will allow is to attract the very best youngsters, and we will continue to develop top class talent, as we have already been made famous for. However, until the day that we can pay these kids the fortunes on offer in Manchester,Liverpool or London, they will want to move on as soon as they have a good season. Les Reed was very naive to say there would be no fire sale, but in a way he was not wrong. We aren't selling because we have debts to clear, we're selling because these players now suddenly have fame, and agents know they can get a huge rise for them, and we aren't able to match that. And that's before you add in Champions league, and the higher profile exposure of being at a 'megaclub'. My only real criticism is that we've allowed this to happen all in one transfer window. Everton, who are the club closest to what I believe we could realistically achieve, sell1-2 per year. At some point Barkley will follow the same path as Rodwell, Rooney etc. but probably next season, perhaps with Coleman. And John Stoanes the season after.And to be fair, who else is left in their side that the big boys would want? We seem to have a much deeper vein of talent that the big boys want, and that's huge credit to our beloved club. Obviously I'm nervous about the next season, but as a Saints, and generally a footy, fan, I can't wait to get back on it!![/p][/quote]Everton have been in the top division for at least 80 years, so they 'dribble' players. We have been back for just two and last year we surprised everyone, that why it's a flood. Rising_Son
  • Score: 2

9:45am Sat 26 Jul 14

thesaint88 says...

Saint 2701 wrote:
Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!!

Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going.

Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-(
Absolutely 100% right! not many people liked cortese but he was a fantastic business man nobody could argue that! also it am 100% convinced that none of these players would have gone if he was still here! she is selling up shortly once she has sold all our talented players and pocketed the money! **** off now tank
[quote][p][bold]Saint 2701[/bold] wrote: Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!! Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going. Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-([/p][/quote]Absolutely 100% right! not many people liked cortese but he was a fantastic business man nobody could argue that! also it am 100% convinced that none of these players would have gone if he was still here! she is selling up shortly once she has sold all our talented players and pocketed the money! **** off now tank thesaint88
  • Score: 3

9:45am Sat 26 Jul 14

WORZEL says...

FOR SALE
A unique opportunity to acquire a British Premiere League football (soccer) club - Totally debt free - freehold stadium - proven infrastructure - ability to build own team from a weak base line. Attractive investment options. Interested parties should in the first instance contact the CFO, Liebherr Cranes, Normandy Lane, Stratton Business Park, Biggleswade, SG18 8QB
FOR SALE A unique opportunity to acquire a British Premiere League football (soccer) club - Totally debt free - freehold stadium - proven infrastructure - ability to build own team from a weak base line. Attractive investment options. Interested parties should in the first instance contact the CFO, Liebherr Cranes, Normandy Lane, Stratton Business Park, Biggleswade, SG18 8QB WORZEL
  • Score: 5

9:46am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

Chapperall wrote:
cpnhadock wrote:
I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though!

However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate.

As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school.

Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;)

Coyr&ws
Hard ball until the figure goes up and then they will sell. I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players! There is no evidence to suggest that we are seeking more players or even in the market only giving stupid offers of £3m for Forster.
I am also a true supporter but just because you see things going pear shaped and have your say you are called a moaner by the happy clappers and hand wringers who appear to be happy in seeing our club taken apart.
They can't even get the new shirts right as they are all too small.
Get a grip les Reid and give the supporters something to start believing again. Those who watched the match with Bournemouth last night, it wasn't very convincing yes Targett did well but the defence looked suspect. We need a replacement for Lovren immediately, and if Spider is sold I dread to think!
"I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players!" And who exactly has said they're happy about it?
[quote][p][bold]Chapperall[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]cpnhadock[/bold] wrote: I am worried - yes, but I am also excited about the start of the new season. I think it's going to be a very tough one! I love our club though! However, I am more disappointed by the clear lack of communication from within the club. The fact is we were given assurances by reed & Krueger which could not have been less accurate. As for the "inundated with top class players that are wanting to come to saints" according to les reed - must have miss heard, maybe he meant 'top of the class', the 15 year old Torquay keeper we signed must have just done really well at school. Atleast we are playing hardball with Cardiff over Fonte's move!! ;) Coyr&ws[/p][/quote]Hard ball until the figure goes up and then they will sell. I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players! There is no evidence to suggest that we are seeking more players or even in the market only giving stupid offers of £3m for Forster. I am also a true supporter but just because you see things going pear shaped and have your say you are called a moaner by the happy clappers and hand wringers who appear to be happy in seeing our club taken apart. They can't even get the new shirts right as they are all too small. Get a grip les Reid and give the supporters something to start believing again. Those who watched the match with Bournemouth last night, it wasn't very convincing yes Targett did well but the defence looked suspect. We need a replacement for Lovren immediately, and if Spider is sold I dread to think![/p][/quote]"I have read all the crap from the happy clappers on this site and can't understand their logic. How can they be happy when we have completely lost the spine of the team and most of our best players!" And who exactly has said they're happy about it? Rising_Son
  • Score: 3

9:47am Sat 26 Jul 14

costa gaz says...

jls217 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............


. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out.
I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose.
What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them.
Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison
Stop digging your hole JLS.... you be more respected if you could accept you were completely wrong, and apologise to the half a dozen or so posters you have abused over the last couple of months.
Enjoy your breakfast.
[quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out. I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose. What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them. Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison[/p][/quote]Stop digging your hole JLS.... you be more respected if you could accept you were completely wrong, and apologise to the half a dozen or so posters you have abused over the last couple of months. Enjoy your breakfast. costa gaz
  • Score: 1

9:47am Sat 26 Jul 14

Bazultra says...

Im so glad I havnt wasted my money on a season ticket for this shower of sh@%. I lost faith as soon as we lost Lambert who was under so called contract. The board didnt even put u a fight. Not a selling club my a@$. I wont be buying our new shirt either Katerina can do one for me. I Boycot tbe club when Rupert Lowe returned for his 2nd spell I can see me doing it again. Our youthful team with so much potential basically being auctioned off. We are not supposed to need the money but obviously KATERINA doesnt have enough! Bringing Koeman Pelle and Tadic in as replacements is to soften the blow in my opinion. I say Katerina and the board OUT
Im so glad I havnt wasted my money on a season ticket for this shower of sh@%. I lost faith as soon as we lost Lambert who was under so called contract. The board didnt even put u a fight. Not a selling club my a@$. I wont be buying our new shirt either Katerina can do one for me. I Boycot tbe club when Rupert Lowe returned for his 2nd spell I can see me doing it again. Our youthful team with so much potential basically being auctioned off. We are not supposed to need the money but obviously KATERINA doesnt have enough! Bringing Koeman Pelle and Tadic in as replacements is to soften the blow in my opinion. I say Katerina and the board OUT Bazultra
  • Score: 5

9:49am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

saintforever wrote:
can i ask for a refund on my season ticket - surely i could ask under the sale of goods act as what i was buying no longer exists - when i bought it we had a good chance of doing the same as last season with a great group of players - now we have sold lots of those players and only replaced with 2 - i think we will be lucky to avoid bottom 6
Why not seek legal advice?
[quote][p][bold]saintforever[/bold] wrote: can i ask for a refund on my season ticket - surely i could ask under the sale of goods act as what i was buying no longer exists - when i bought it we had a good chance of doing the same as last season with a great group of players - now we have sold lots of those players and only replaced with 2 - i think we will be lucky to avoid bottom 6[/p][/quote]Why not seek legal advice? Rising_Son
  • Score: 1

9:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

justaSaintsfan says...

montecristosaint wrote:
As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.
You are basically saying that SFC is being asset stripped by an owner who does not care about the club.

I disagree. I believe that Katharina does care about Saints and she attends matches. Can you imagine an uncaring, asset stripping owner attending matches? I can't. Do you believe that Katharina has been at matches only to say her goodbyes?

The main assets of a football club are its best players. I suggest that selling all the players before selling the club would reduce the club's value to a considerable extent, thus leading to less money overall being paid than from selling the club as a going concern, complete with all its best players.

Saints won only admirers last season, not tropnies. We finished eighth in the Premier League, some way off seventh place. The club was several good players short of being a top club. The lack of sufficient, quality players in our squad became apparent when some of our players suffered long term injuries.

My thinking is that perhaps SFC is aiming to take advantage of the higher clubs coveting our best players by selling to them at over inflated prices. Lovren was a bargain buy last year, so maybe our scouting team have found more bargain buys that will actually add more overall quality to our squad that was somewhat lacking last season. We did, of course, play much very good football last season, but should have scored more goals. Our attack and defence also both lacked quality cover for injuries and suspensions.

In the coming weeks we shall see how many new players will be signed and how good they will turn out to be. That should at last demonstrate the true ambition of SFC.

I will remain patient about player departures and arrivals, as there are more deals still to be done. A manager of Ronald Koeman's calibre would obviously not have come to St. Marys without funds being available to buy players.

We shall quite soon actually see real evidence of the true ambition of SFC, rather than all the positive and negative speculation. Not until at least then will either the happy clappers or the neggie veggies have bragging rights!!!

The neggie veggies and the happy clappers have two important things in common. We all support SFC and we all care about the club. We are vehement because we care so much. Whatever happens, I shall remain just a Saints fan, just one of the many thousands of supporters without whom there would be no SFC.

I think Katharina is trying to do Saint Markus proud. We shall see!
[quote][p][bold]montecristosaint[/bold] wrote: As I have said time and again there is something going on that we have not been told about , my guess is that the club is being sold, but no reporter seems to have followed this angle up. Every Saints player seems to be up for grabs, sounds to me that Liebherr is looking to cash in on intangible assets this summer before agreeing a sale of the club. The only question is to whom.[/p][/quote]You are basically saying that SFC is being asset stripped by an owner who does not care about the club. I disagree. I believe that Katharina does care about Saints and she attends matches. Can you imagine an uncaring, asset stripping owner attending matches? I can't. Do you believe that Katharina has been at matches only to say her goodbyes? The main assets of a football club are its best players. I suggest that selling all the players before selling the club would reduce the club's value to a considerable extent, thus leading to less money overall being paid than from selling the club as a going concern, complete with all its best players. Saints won only admirers last season, not tropnies. We finished eighth in the Premier League, some way off seventh place. The club was several good players short of being a top club. The lack of sufficient, quality players in our squad became apparent when some of our players suffered long term injuries. My thinking is that perhaps SFC is aiming to take advantage of the higher clubs coveting our best players by selling to them at over inflated prices. Lovren was a bargain buy last year, so maybe our scouting team have found more bargain buys that will actually add more overall quality to our squad that was somewhat lacking last season. We did, of course, play much very good football last season, but should have scored more goals. Our attack and defence also both lacked quality cover for injuries and suspensions. In the coming weeks we shall see how many new players will be signed and how good they will turn out to be. That should at last demonstrate the true ambition of SFC. I will remain patient about player departures and arrivals, as there are more deals still to be done. A manager of Ronald Koeman's calibre would obviously not have come to St. Marys without funds being available to buy players. We shall quite soon actually see real evidence of the true ambition of SFC, rather than all the positive and negative speculation. Not until at least then will either the happy clappers or the neggie veggies have bragging rights!!! The neggie veggies and the happy clappers have two important things in common. We all support SFC and we all care about the club. We are vehement because we care so much. Whatever happens, I shall remain just a Saints fan, just one of the many thousands of supporters without whom there would be no SFC. I think Katharina is trying to do Saint Markus proud. We shall see! justaSaintsfan
  • Score: -2

9:50am Sat 26 Jul 14

jls217 says...

costa gaz wrote:
jls217 wrote:
BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website.
This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope.

Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.
....And you still refuse to lay the blame where it belongs UNBELIEVABLE!!!!
Les read and the board are responsible for this debacle, the buck stops at board level.
None of the players are to blame, none were offered improved contracts so they went. simple!!!!
""Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? """"" Too bl00dy right they did, wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
The meddling media... ffs, they got everything right, to be fair it was not difficult

JLS, when is the penny going to drop, you have been in denial all along, time to accept you were 100% wrong.
Please educate us in how you know NOBODY was offered an increased contract? Were you there? Are you the agent of these players?

Saints pay what Saints can afford - simple housekeeping. If we can't afford their demands/expectations - what are the options open to the decision makers - once again please educate us mere mortals.

So if I am 100% wrong all along it suggests to me you are/were 100% correct - pretty arrogant of you to think thus given the fact that you know nothing of what transpired then and know little more now.

Money and power is to blame if you must look for scapegoats Waz. I just look forward to next season. I put faith in the management and owner of the club because there is no other option - they are there, they are making the decisions and I can either get all bent out of shape over something over which I have no control and never will have or I can enjoy me footie - I've already made it clear which is my choice.
You continue your nonsensical, ill- informed, illogical ranting which seems to be your method of choice and we'll see at the end of the season which of us has enjoyed what is meant, for us at least, to be fun and entertainment- now there is something which I can probably foresee with some degree of accuracy as I already have evidence to suggest which way it will roll. Thank you for your input Waz it has been..............in
spirational.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]BarnetSaint[/bold] wrote: Disgraceful if true. What in the hell is happening? Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have. People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £. Bottom 6 beckons. And why have those 3 remained silent all this time? No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club. Shameful.[/p][/quote]Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website. This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope. Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.[/p][/quote]....And you still refuse to lay the blame where it belongs UNBELIEVABLE!!!! Les read and the board are responsible for this debacle, the buck stops at board level. None of the players are to blame, none were offered improved contracts so they went. simple!!!! ""Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? """"" Too bl00dy right they did, wake up and smell the coffee!!!! The meddling media... ffs, they got everything right, to be fair it was not difficult JLS, when is the penny going to drop, you have been in denial all along, time to accept you were 100% wrong.[/p][/quote]Please educate us in how you know NOBODY was offered an increased contract? Were you there? Are you the agent of these players? Saints pay what Saints can afford - simple housekeeping. If we can't afford their demands/expectations - what are the options open to the decision makers - once again please educate us mere mortals. So if I am 100% wrong all along it suggests to me you are/were 100% correct - pretty arrogant of you to think thus given the fact that you know nothing of what transpired then and know little more now. Money and power is to blame if you must look for scapegoats Waz. I just look forward to next season. I put faith in the management and owner of the club because there is no other option - they are there, they are making the decisions and I can either get all bent out of shape over something over which I have no control and never will have or I can enjoy me footie - I've already made it clear which is my choice. You continue your nonsensical, ill- informed, illogical ranting which seems to be your method of choice and we'll see at the end of the season which of us has enjoyed what is meant, for us at least, to be fun and entertainment- now there is something which I can probably foresee with some degree of accuracy as I already have evidence to suggest which way it will roll. Thank you for your input Waz it has been..............in spirational. jls217
  • Score: -2

9:51am Sat 26 Jul 14

Confucious says...

Well I never - what a depressing doom-laden bunch of surrendering, no hopers you all are. I've never heard such craven, chicken-hearted, gutless, lily-livered, spineless, weak-kneed, blubber-laden, snivelling tosh from Saints fans in all my life.

Thank goodness the more typical fans are not on here - the positive, true-grit, indomitable. fearless and doughty crew who stand tall and keep the faith whilst the wailing whimperers on here crumple and sob in the corner.
Well I never - what a depressing doom-laden bunch of surrendering, no hopers you all are. I've never heard such craven, chicken-hearted, gutless, lily-livered, spineless, weak-kneed, blubber-laden, snivelling tosh from Saints fans in all my life. Thank goodness the more typical fans are not on here - the positive, true-grit, indomitable. fearless and doughty crew who stand tall and keep the faith whilst the wailing whimperers on here crumple and sob in the corner. Confucious
  • Score: -5

9:51am Sat 26 Jul 14

curtisaint says...

If the board had any decency they would offer us our money back i did not pay over £700 thinking the team was going to be destroyed.I feel sorry for the manager i am sure he didn't know this was going to happen.We were 12/1 with the bookies to be relegated now we are down to 4/1 that tells the story.
Curtisaint
If the board had any decency they would offer us our money back i did not pay over £700 thinking the team was going to be destroyed.I feel sorry for the manager i am sure he didn't know this was going to happen.We were 12/1 with the bookies to be relegated now we are down to 4/1 that tells the story. Curtisaint curtisaint
  • Score: 5

9:52am Sat 26 Jul 14

warrens 76 says...

Mister E wrote:
Prit wrote:
All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????
Ummm, sell all your assets, then try and sell your club?
Without your assets the club is less attractive, so, far fewer potential buyers! Those potential buyers would pay you far, far less than you would have got by selling your club with all your assets!
The Board may be many things, but they ain't stupid!!
Oh yes they are…'we have inherited an awkward financial situation' ring a bell..

'no one will leave who we do not want to leave'
.
' all money will be reinvested in the team'.

'we cannot believe the quality throughout europe wanting to come to this club'.

'We have already identified targets '

The board of BHAFC have no intention of selling the Goldstone ground.

I will not pretend to be happy and those with complete faith in the board are 8loody deluded.
[quote][p][bold]Mister E[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Prit[/bold] wrote: All assets now gone. Just the club to sell then. Can nobody see what is happening before their very eyes ???????[/p][/quote]Ummm, sell all your assets, then try and sell your club? Without your assets the club is less attractive, so, far fewer potential buyers! Those potential buyers would pay you far, far less than you would have got by selling your club with all your assets! The Board may be many things, but they ain't stupid!![/p][/quote]Oh yes they are…'we have inherited an awkward financial situation' ring a bell.. 'no one will leave who we do not want to leave' . ' all money will be reinvested in the team'. 'we cannot believe the quality throughout europe wanting to come to this club'. 'We have already identified targets ' The board of BHAFC have no intention of selling the Goldstone ground. I will not pretend to be happy and those with complete faith in the board are 8loody deluded. warrens 76
  • Score: 3

9:53am Sat 26 Jul 14

TPFKARTSNINZ says...

jls217 wrote:
Saint 2701 wrote:
Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!!

Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going.

Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-(
Pathetic - Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe it was Cortese who somehow had a hand in the way this has all unfolded. I used to think he was the hand that would steer us to better things. How misled was I?
Just what did Katharina do wrong in your eyes?
If I came to your house and said to you put everything you own into my hands and I'll look after it all for you, so you don't have to worry about anything - I can guess what your answer would be.
If I then threw my dolly out and started making demands and issuing threats because I couldn't get you do to what I wanted - I'm guessing you'd run me off your property with a warning not to return. (and maybe with a scar or two to remind me not to return)
Well that, simplified is what Cortese did. No surprise to me she wouldn't let him spend all her money - you wouldn't dream of it so why should she. She hasn't made these players leave. Their agents, their own ambition, their egos, their lack of professionalism in adhering to their contracts, their lack of feeling about the club in the same way you and I do, their desire to earn half as much again as Saints could afford to pay them - all those things made them want to move on. All anyone involved in this club could do was make sure whoever wanted them paid a heavy price - and in that the management have been pretty successful. Not sure whether Freddie is the man to lead us into calmer waters or not - he has to be given the chance and Rambo needs years to put the ship back on the right course, one thing I am certain of is that there is no room for Cortese back here ever again. If he didn't start this mess, he probably could have stopped it but chose not to and maybe even chose to make it worse if he could - guess we'll never know for sure. Onwards and upwards 2701 and if you're going to be a sniper mate please make sure you're aiming at the right targets. Ask anyone who's been in the military - there is nothing worse than poorly aimed ammo going off around you - no such thing as friendly fire, if it's close to you it's downright scary and can have dire consequences. Please make that connection with what you're saying even if you mean well when you open fire.
A great season is coming our way.
A sane voice in a wilderness of cowards & spineless fools.
[quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Saint 2701[/bold] wrote: Absolutely taking the pi55 now!!!!!!!! Whilst i appreciate Marcus saving our club, this fat cow could leave us in a far worse position than ever with the way were going. Please come and save us Cortese!! :'-([/p][/quote]Pathetic - Has it occurred to you that maybe, just maybe it was Cortese who somehow had a hand in the way this has all unfolded. I used to think he was the hand that would steer us to better things. How misled was I? Just what did Katharina do wrong in your eyes? If I came to your house and said to you put everything you own into my hands and I'll look after it all for you, so you don't have to worry about anything - I can guess what your answer would be. If I then threw my dolly out and started making demands and issuing threats because I couldn't get you do to what I wanted - I'm guessing you'd run me off your property with a warning not to return. (and maybe with a scar or two to remind me not to return) Well that, simplified is what Cortese did. No surprise to me she wouldn't let him spend all her money - you wouldn't dream of it so why should she. She hasn't made these players leave. Their agents, their own ambition, their egos, their lack of professionalism in adhering to their contracts, their lack of feeling about the club in the same way you and I do, their desire to earn half as much again as Saints could afford to pay them - all those things made them want to move on. All anyone involved in this club could do was make sure whoever wanted them paid a heavy price - and in that the management have been pretty successful. Not sure whether Freddie is the man to lead us into calmer waters or not - he has to be given the chance and Rambo needs years to put the ship back on the right course, one thing I am certain of is that there is no room for Cortese back here ever again. If he didn't start this mess, he probably could have stopped it but chose not to and maybe even chose to make it worse if he could - guess we'll never know for sure. Onwards and upwards 2701 and if you're going to be a sniper mate please make sure you're aiming at the right targets. Ask anyone who's been in the military - there is nothing worse than poorly aimed ammo going off around you - no such thing as friendly fire, if it's close to you it's downright scary and can have dire consequences. Please make that connection with what you're saying even if you mean well when you open fire. A great season is coming our way.[/p][/quote]A sane voice in a wilderness of cowards & spineless fools. TPFKARTSNINZ
  • Score: -8

9:53am Sat 26 Jul 14

Blackknight says...

I was criticised on this forum when I forecast a 'fire sale' of all our best players following the departure of Cortese and the appointed of a new board. Sadly I wasn't too far wrong though.

Still nice know Saints are not a selling club.

With potentially over £100m in (all to be invested in the team according to Reed, LOL) and just £20m spent, our manager and best players gone or going I am finding it hard to be optimistic about our prospects next season. Unless there is going to be several quality signings coming in soon I predict a difficult season ahead.
I was criticised on this forum when I forecast a 'fire sale' of all our best players following the departure of Cortese and the appointed of a new board. Sadly I wasn't too far wrong though. Still nice know Saints are not a selling club. With potentially over £100m in (all to be invested in the team according to Reed, LOL) and just £20m spent, our manager and best players gone or going I am finding it hard to be optimistic about our prospects next season. Unless there is going to be several quality signings coming in soon I predict a difficult season ahead. Blackknight
  • Score: 6

9:54am Sat 26 Jul 14

warrens 76 says...

ctsaint wrote:
Tony in Liberia wrote:
FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will.

Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season?

Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night".

There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them.

Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it.

Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ...

So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter.

So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that.

My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs?

But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money.

You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal!

And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em.

This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen.

So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years.

You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.
Well put Tony. I don't like seeing a settled team dismantled , the fact is we can't compete on wages, and may never be able to...

We have a fantastic business model that gives us a long term future and stability. If managed correctly this club should never see the likes of what happened 6 years ago again.

We have a famed academy, we are promoting them to first team football, Targett, Reed , Gallagher and Isgrove will be the new Laliar and Shaw ........that seems to be forgotten on here by some, there are no doubt others too - this will continue to attract the BEST youngsters who will see a career path for themselves at SFC.

All the while the positive income flow gives us significant options if we do want to deal in the market. We will still have a very British heart if you look at this years academy players breaking into the squad, and I prefer this to a wholesale purchase of relatively unknowns from other leagues, the Southampton Way is partly about promoting the youth from within.

And to those of you making abusive remarks about Kat Leibher you are a disgrace......
It's almost as if some "fans" of the club want us to "chase the dream" ask Leeds fans about that and where it ended , and Pompey fans for that matter........the same fans will moan about whoever we buy if they don't perform like footballing gods in their first few games, blame the board and label them a waste of money.

The business model is sound, and with long term planning might, just might give us the success we crave. I never imagined we would do as well as we did last year , and I have low expectations for this , but I remain a fan and keep a balanced view, some of you should try being a little more reflective and trusting in the very thing that got us our success.........the academy and the Liebhers.
you should support a firm of accountants mate.
[quote][p][bold]ctsaint[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]Tony in Liberia[/bold] wrote: FFS, let's get real. The reason people are buying our players is because, by some weird and probably never to be repeated freak of nature, we happen to have a load of players at one time who are good enough to play for the top 4, and the top four have come and got them. There's a pecking order in the game, and it's dictated by money - not how much you've got, but how much you can pay the players. We CANNOT compete with the top 6 on wages, and the way the game is now organised we probably never will. Players want to play for the top 4 if they can - of course they do, I would to. It's a short career - JRod may never come back properly from his injury - and they have the right to make as much money and win as many trophies as they can from it. I don't blame them (although there's a gulf in class in how they did it), I'd do the same - and let's be real, we all would. Had ‘Fergies Fledglings’ been developed and introduced as Saints players, how many of you believe that Giggs, Beckham, Scholes, Neville and Butt would of still been Saints players the next season? Yes, Le Tiss was 'loyal', and we love him for it, but again, be real - how many teams ever actually came and tried to buy him? Chelsea, once as I remember, and Lawrie Mac made a big joke about it, and they weren't that good at the time, so it wasn’t much of a test. Now don't get me wrong, I love Le Tiss, and I love the fact that he only played for us, but at the time (a) there wasn't such a discrepancy in wages between the clubs, and (b) he was a lazy fugger, and was happy being the star here and not having to work too hard to stay in the team. And also, when we were fighting our annual relegation battle, and he was as close to a one man team as you'll ever see in football, he said every year that, if we got relegated, he would leave because - and I'm quoting from memory, but I'm sure it's reasonably accurate - "I'm not going to play up at Rochdale on a wet and windy Tuesday night". There is no conspiracy, there is no unseen master plan, there's just the unfortunate fact that we have a team of players of whom six or seven are top 4 material and, as I said, the top 4 have come and got them. That’s what happens. We are at least lucky in that we got top dollar for them. Now, of course, we could of added players and gotten to the top 4 ourselves; That's apparently what Cortese promised, but how was he going to do that? He would of had to smash our wages policy, and he couldn't of done that without Katherine noticing and pointing out that, a la Leeds, Pompey, QPR, paying those types of wages was a recipe for a short trip up the swannee with a short plank. She wouldn't of bankrolled it, and why should she? And no Arab billionaire is going to buy us, when he could have a club like, say, Villa, who have bigger ground and catchment area of fans to fill it. Now, of course, the players could have just played a little goddarn better - we threw away how many points when we were in the lead? Enough to get into the Champions' League, as I remember - and we would of made it, but they didn't - in part largely to the fact that MoPo didn't have a plan B, or £80,000,000 of players on the bench to bring on and change a game when needed. But that's another matter ... So, there's no big conspiracy, no hidden agenda - we are just a victim of our own success. I'd love to tell all these players "you've got contracts; shut the hell up and keep playing", but deep down even the neggiest neggie amongst us knows that's a non-starter. So, what to do? Be a club like Everton, who develop a team of players who are almost but not quite god enough for the top 4, and develop a great system under a great manager that makes them play above their weight? That's a strong possibility. Players like Steve Davis are ideal for that. My preferred plan would be Seedhouse's excellent suggestion to take all the money and not buy players at all but build a 45,000 ground at Stoneham and accept being mid-table until it's finished and we can generate more income. But would we fill it? And would 45,000 be enough anyway, when we don’t have the global attraction of the top clubs? But whatever happens, there is no way that anyone at the club could stop what's happening from happening, and it's pointless to stamp our feet and demand that they do. All clubs are selling clubs when the player wants to leave, and the buying club has enough money. You don't believe me? Look at Athletico Madrid. They couldn't of had a much more successful season; winning the league and being 90 seconds or so away from winning the Champions' League. And what happens - do their players have a chat and say "my word, lads, look what we could achieve here"? Do the effing ell; they say to their agents "go and get me a big money move to Chelsea". You think WE are sick? Think how their fans are feeling; my mate who lives in Madrid is practically suicidal! And what are we saying? We’re telling the board, "Go to Feyenord and buy that guy"; "Go to Celtic and buy that guy" - go to bleedin Burnley, who have just made it into the Prem and arelooking forward to their season, and say "ok, we're buying your best striker because we've got enough money and we can". No real difference, as far as I can see, except that, to paraphrase Clive Dunn, nobody likes it up ‘em. This is football, and we're stuck with it. Unless we find a way to change the Premier league, which we could do if we all stopped buying the product, going to games, getting Sky subscriptions, which isn't going to happen. So what do I do? Well, in the face of that, I'm not going to turn into a depressive negative moaner, and I'm sure as hell not going to wish ill on Katherine, and I'm not going to look for fantastical theories to explain what's going on. I'm going to support my team, whoever the eleven on the pitch are, I'm going to acknowledge that the board are probably doing the best anyone could do in the circumstances within a system that is basically a cartel for the top 4 / 6, even if that bad is pretty pathetic (Rommel was the a brilliant general, but he couldn’t stop the allies at El Alamein because we had more guns, bullets, planes, shells, men and tanks, and he had a leader who basically said they weren’t allowed to surrender – it doesn’t make him a bad general, it makes him a great general in a carpy situation. And before the negs point it out, obviously I’m not saying our board are Rommels, but I don’t believe they are mugs). They know much more about football than me, that’s for sure, and I'm going to trust that they know that we need more players and are going to get them, and I'm going to enjoy watching Saints, as I've done for almost 50 years. You can say I've stuck my head in the sand, give me 7,000 thumbs down, I don't much care - I hate what's happening as much as anyone, but you aren't going to stop me looking forward to watching my team, enjoying the season as much as I can, cheering when I get the chance, getting drunk after the game ... I'm a dispositional optimist by nature, and football is just a game at the end of the day, and until we change the financial rules by which it is played, this isn't the last time this is going to happen, not to us, not to any club who gets a great team together. Unless they are Barcelona or Real Madrid.[/p][/quote]Well put Tony. I don't like seeing a settled team dismantled , the fact is we can't compete on wages, and may never be able to... We have a fantastic business model that gives us a long term future and stability. If managed correctly this club should never see the likes of what happened 6 years ago again. We have a famed academy, we are promoting them to first team football, Targett, Reed , Gallagher and Isgrove will be the new Laliar and Shaw ........that seems to be forgotten on here by some, there are no doubt others too - this will continue to attract the BEST youngsters who will see a career path for themselves at SFC. All the while the positive income flow gives us significant options if we do want to deal in the market. We will still have a very British heart if you look at this years academy players breaking into the squad, and I prefer this to a wholesale purchase of relatively unknowns from other leagues, the Southampton Way is partly about promoting the youth from within. And to those of you making abusive remarks about Kat Leibher you are a disgrace...... It's almost as if some "fans" of the club want us to "chase the dream" ask Leeds fans about that and where it ended , and Pompey fans for that matter........the same fans will moan about whoever we buy if they don't perform like footballing gods in their first few games, blame the board and label them a waste of money. The business model is sound, and with long term planning might, just might give us the success we crave. I never imagined we would do as well as we did last year , and I have low expectations for this , but I remain a fan and keep a balanced view, some of you should try being a little more reflective and trusting in the very thing that got us our success.........the academy and the Liebhers.[/p][/quote]you should support a firm of accountants mate. warrens 76
  • Score: 4

9:54am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

WORZEL wrote:
FOR SALE
A unique opportunity to acquire a British Premiere League football (soccer) club - Totally debt free - freehold stadium - proven infrastructure - ability to build own team from a weak base line. Attractive investment options. Interested parties should in the first instance contact the CFO, Liebherr Cranes, Normandy Lane, Stratton Business Park, Biggleswade, SG18 8QB
But, we've got nothing to do with Liebherr Cranes. Do try to keep up.
[quote][p][bold]WORZEL[/bold] wrote: FOR SALE A unique opportunity to acquire a British Premiere League football (soccer) club - Totally debt free - freehold stadium - proven infrastructure - ability to build own team from a weak base line. Attractive investment options. Interested parties should in the first instance contact the CFO, Liebherr Cranes, Normandy Lane, Stratton Business Park, Biggleswade, SG18 8QB[/p][/quote]But, we've got nothing to do with Liebherr Cranes. Do try to keep up. Rising_Son
  • Score: -3

9:57am Sat 26 Jul 14

Rising_Son says...

costa gaz wrote:
jls217 wrote:
costa gaz wrote:
JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still?
No one will leave...............



. PAH!!!!

Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.
How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out.
I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose.
What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them.
Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison
Stop digging your hole JLS.... you be more respected if you could accept you were completely wrong, and apologise to the half a dozen or so posters you have abused over the last couple of months.
Enjoy your breakfast.
Once more you feign victimhood. The first resort of a WUM.
[quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]jls217[/bold] wrote: [quote][p][bold]costa gaz[/bold] wrote: JLS, HE Bob, osprey, nomorerumours, Rising sun, 101, and all the HC's that berated a few of us.... still feel that there is no exodus? Everything rosy in the garden still? No one will leave............... . PAH!!!! Luckily I never believed a bl00dy word any of you ever said.[/p][/quote]How smug you must feel Costa Waz. I don't remember anyone of those you have pointed your crooked warty finger at not fearing an exodus. What I do remember very clearly is most of us saying at some time or other to wait until something was confirmed before spitting the dummy out. I also do not recall saying everything in any garden was rosy. I do remember suggesting we should all calm down and wait to see what was really happening before we started considering an overdose. What has just happened (and is still happening) to the club has been downright nasty but if these players (for whatever reason) decide their future lies elsewhere - what I have learned in the last couple of months - is just to let them float to whatever sewer they make for themselves and make the buzzard wanting to devour them wince when it comes to paying for them. Saints will still be in the business of football and hopefully I'll still be in charge of my faculties enough to enjoy that 15 years from now when this is a distant memory and those players will be thinking about a future without football as they retire etc. If I can I'll still be sat there cheering on whoever is wearing the kit and whatever league we find ourselves in - I think the future is bright - you are free to think whatever you wish because, and this may come as a shock to one who has such a high opinion of how important he is in the greater scheme of south coast football, you opinions count for as little as mine and anyone else posting here and elsewhere - yes mate sorry but your dismal and twisted views count not a jot and whether you have listened to a word any of us has said (I would have guessed that would be the case though as someone with that amount of bile and illogical hostility in them is frequently going to arrive at unreasonable outcomes at some point) Off now for a big fried b'fast and to put to the test whether your disdain will affect the taste and digestion or not - my hunch is I will be able to dispense with any negative effects with a belch and a good **** just I am able to with your poison[/p][/quote]Stop digging your hole JLS.... you be more respected if you could accept you were completely wrong, and apologise to the half a dozen or so posters you have abused over the last couple of months. Enjoy your breakfast.[/p][/quote]Once more you feign victimhood. The first resort of a WUM. Rising_Son
  • Score: -5

9:59am Sat 26 Jul 14

Bazultra says...

I said from the day we let our talisman go the board didnt have a scooby doo. You dont sell your car until you have a replacement. Now they are letting everybody who wants to leave go without a fight. Truth is they want to sell and thats very evident now. Cortese was the man with the vision make no mistake about that. He did eveything it said on the tin. I said before to everybody on here about the half an hour interview he done with the BBC about turning us into the next Barca. The interview was a breath of frest air and you knew from everything he said that this guy meant business. Im not trying to say look everyone I told you so its their for you all to see. Im totally discusted KATERINA and the board OUT.
I said from the day we let our talisman go the board didnt have a scooby doo. You dont sell your car until you have a replacement. Now they are letting everybody who wants to leave go without a fight. Truth is they want to sell and thats very evident now. Cortese was the man with the vision make no mistake about that. He did eveything it said on the tin. I said before to everybody on here about the half an hour interview he done with the BBC about turning us into the next Barca. The interview was a breath of frest air and you knew from everything he said that this guy meant business. Im not trying to say look everyone I told you so its their for you all to see. Im totally discusted KATERINA and the board OUT. Bazultra
  • Score: 6

10:00am Sat 26 Jul 14

warrens 76 says...

costa gaz wrote:
jls217 wrote:
BarnetSaint wrote:
Disgraceful if true.
What in the hell is happening?
Reed and the ice hockey bloke seem to have been given instructrutions from liebher to just sell every last decent player we have.
People from inside the game rate chambers as one of the best prospects in the country and we can't even see him develop for us before we take the £.
Bottom 6 beckons.
And why have those 3 remained silent all this time?
No doubt we'll draft in a few ( foreign ) replacements but the heart and soul is being ripped out of our club.
Shameful.
Not shameful Barnet - just inevitable. I am ever the optimist however and never see a player as gone until the announcement is made on the website.
This may yet turn out to be media meddling again - we can only hope.

Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? They, like us, must be thinking there is no end to this. It's what happens next though that will be the measure of how good the team will be. Who can fill those boots from the development squad and who we buy in and just importantly how much we can make from the outgoing and how little we can spend on the incoming. Buy below market price, sell above market price = Bright (but bloody frustrating) future anything different to that and we start on the rocky slope back to where we've so recently come from again. The heart and soul is still intact mate just battered and shell shocked - it is indeed shameful and whoever started this downward spiral around about last Christmas should feel the shame but whoever and whatever happened we will probably never be sure of so no point dwelling on it, what we can be sure of is that person will only feel cynical, vengeful pride in the way the club has been affected by their actions. Liarllana has a place in all this - he was the captain and should have been using his influence to steady the ship instead of plotting his own way off the ship - who else to point the finger at - don't know for sure. Water under the bridge mate. Next season is going to be fantastic watching these youngster learn from their mistakes and the older pros and develop into international standard players. (and unfortunately attract the attentions of the agents and the money men) Such is life as a Saints fan.
....And you still refuse to lay the blame where it belongs UNBELIEVABLE!!!!
Les read and the board are responsible for this debacle, the buck stops at board level.
None of the players are to blame, none were offered improved contracts so they went. simple!!!!
""Do you really think anyone in the higher echelons of the club made a conscious decision to get rid of players? """"" Too bl00dy right they did, wake up and smell the coffee!!!!
The meddling media... ffs, they got everything right, to be fair it was not difficult

JLS, when is the penny going to drop, you have been in denial all along, time to accept you were 100% wrong.
Quite agree, people are asking theboard to sort out this mess but here is a fact, in years of running business's I can tell you that the management who got you into the mess are never EVER the ones to get you out of it…

Were this possible the mess would not have happened on their watch.
[quote][p][bold]cost