Clattenburg not welcome at Saints

Mark Clattenburg has words with Adam Lallana at the final whistle of the Everton v Saints match.

Mark Clattenburg has words with Adam Lallana at the final whistle of the Everton v Saints match.

First published in Sport
Last updated

SAINTS legend Terry Paine admits he was not surprised when the Professional Game Match Officials Board (PGMOL) decided there was no case to answer against Mark Clattenburg.

The PGMOL decided to take no action following Saints’ complaint about his response to Adam Lallana’s claims for a penalty at the end of the 2-1 defeat to Everton at Goodison Park last Sunday.

Saints wrote to the PGMOL, revealing that Clattenburg told Lallana: “You are very different now, since you’ve played for England – you never used to be like this.” Following the PGMOL’s response, the club is considering a fresh complaint to the Football Association, saying they “do not consider the matter to be over”. Club president Paine said: “My initial reaction is that every time a player or a manager gets cited, they seem to always get found guilty.

“But every time a referee gets cited he gets let off almost straight away. They protect their own like you wouldn’t believe. “Refs usually always get cleared, often within 24 hours. I’m not sure what can be done about it.”

David Armstrong, the former Saints, Middlesbrough and England midfielder, reckons the Clattenburg/Lallana saga is just a sign of the times.

He said: “When I played in the Seventies and Eighties, refs always had a good rapport with the managers and the players. “There were times when things boiled over, of course there were, but it was all left on the pitch at the final whistle. “There was no moaning after the game.

“I had plenty of chats with various referees, some of whom swore, and at times they needed to calm down more than the players.

“But we respected the other party, we knew they were trying to do a good, honest job. At times things got heated but we just got on with it.

“Disagreements are part and parcel of the game. Far too much is made of everything these days, it’s the way the game’s been going for a while. “Everything is highlighted and analysed to the 'nth degree and it doesn’t help when refs say this, that and the other.

“It’s a shame it’s come to this from both parties’ point of view.”

Saints responded to the PGMOL’s decision with a spokesman, saying: “An official insulting any player, no matter his intentions, is clearly not acceptable behaviour. For this reason we do not accept the verdict of the PGMOL in relation to this case, and do not consider the matter to be over. “Under the circumstances we do not feel it appropriate for Mr Clattenburg to officiate in any of our matches until this matter is properly resolved.” Clattenburg has refereed seven Saints games since the club’s return to the Premier League.

The next occasion, whenever that may be, will be the subject of much interest – on and off the pitch.

Comments (18)

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5:54pm Sat 4 Jan 14

Cpt. Kirk's illegitimate love child says...

A lot of refs behave like bullies. Maybe because they are. The refs can't demand respect on the one hand and then behave like Clatt did on the other.
A lot of refs behave like bullies. Maybe because they are. The refs can't demand respect on the one hand and then behave like Clatt did on the other. Cpt. Kirk's illegitimate love child
  • Score: 7

6:12pm Sat 4 Jan 14

magnette says...

Dear Simon,

What was the name of the spokesman at Saints that you quote?

Thank you
Dear Simon, What was the name of the spokesman at Saints that you quote? Thank you magnette
  • Score: 4

7:51pm Sat 4 Jan 14

derek james says...

it is the same as complaining to the law society about a solictor, they close ranks
it is the same as complaining to the law society about a solictor, they close ranks derek james
  • Score: 3

8:31pm Sat 4 Jan 14

Nod says...

magnette wrote:
Dear Simon,

What was the name of the spokesman at Saints that you quote?

Thank you
Jordan Sibley has been creditted for that comment elsewhere.
[quote][p][bold]magnette[/bold] wrote: Dear Simon, What was the name of the spokesman at Saints that you quote? Thank you[/p][/quote]Jordan Sibley has been creditted for that comment elsewhere. Nod
  • Score: 4

8:33pm Sat 4 Jan 14

Norwegian Saint says...

Clatterbrain is dodgy and he was scared to give us an absolute clear penalty or send off their player for that awful foul. The main reason for this was he didn't want to upset the Toffees after 6 years and open old wounds.

The decision at Arsenal with a pull by Fonte... I saw lots of pulling pushing at the Arsenal v Spurs game but he gave nothing.

Respect the ref??? Not this one... never!
Clatterbrain is dodgy and he was scared to give us an absolute clear penalty or send off their player for that awful foul. The main reason for this was he didn't want to upset the Toffees after 6 years and open old wounds. The decision at Arsenal with a pull by Fonte... I saw lots of pulling pushing at the Arsenal v Spurs game but he gave nothing. Respect the ref??? Not this one... never! Norwegian Saint
  • Score: 9

8:33pm Sat 4 Jan 14

northamboyofold says...

Players at all levels have a go at referees, but like it when they get it back, they throw there tools out of the pram. Respect works both ways, grow up and get over it.
Players at all levels have a go at referees, but like it when they get it back, they throw there tools out of the pram. Respect works both ways, grow up and get over it. northamboyofold
  • Score: 0

9:04pm Sat 4 Jan 14

EarlyRiser says...

northamboyofold wrote:
Players at all levels have a go at referees, but like it when they get it back, they throw there tools out of the pram. Respect works both ways, grow up and get over it.
Spot on, grow up. so it's ok to call the ref a c..t tell him to f ...o but to say, well, you weren't like that ...... is a hanging offece for christ sake.
How very very petty
[quote][p][bold]northamboyofold[/bold] wrote: Players at all levels have a go at referees, but like it when they get it back, they throw there tools out of the pram. Respect works both ways, grow up and get over it.[/p][/quote]Spot on, grow up. so it's ok to call the ref a c..t tell him to f ...o but to say, well, you weren't like that ...... is a hanging offece for christ sake. How very very petty EarlyRiser
  • Score: -4

9:18pm Sat 4 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

OK, before this fiasco turned up, how many of the posters on here had ever heard of PGMOL? It stands for Professional Game Match Officials Limited.
Do any of you really think a Professional Official would behave like this clot, well if they know they will get away with it because they are untouchable I suspect some do and will.
OK, before this fiasco turned up, how many of the posters on here had ever heard of PGMOL? It stands for Professional Game Match Officials Limited. Do any of you really think a Professional Official would behave like this clot, well if they know they will get away with it because they are untouchable I suspect some do and will. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 1

9:58pm Sat 4 Jan 14

Velleity says...

From the article above: 'Saints wrote to the PGMOL, revealing that Clattenburg told Lallana: “You are very different now, since you’ve played for England – you never used to be like this."'

This is the first time I've heard it told in this way. Everywhere else it appears that Saints have raised the matter with PGMOL with unspecified complaints.

In response PGMOL (NOT Saints) have said that Clattenburg said "You are very different now...etc".

Subtle difference between the two versions.
From the article above: 'Saints wrote to the PGMOL, revealing that Clattenburg told Lallana: “You are very different now, since you’ve played for England – you never used to be like this."' This is the first time I've heard it told in this way. Everywhere else it appears that Saints have raised the matter with PGMOL with unspecified complaints. In response PGMOL (NOT Saints) have said that Clattenburg said "You are very different now...etc". Subtle difference between the two versions. Velleity
  • Score: 3

9:17am Sun 5 Jan 14

Blackwaterblue says...

I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP!
I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP! Blackwaterblue
  • Score: 1

11:45am Sun 5 Jan 14

el caballo santos101 says...

Blackwaterblue wrote:
I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP!
the player didn't complain, you should read the article and then realise that the club complained. you wont also know that this ref has consistently given poor decisions against our club, stonewall pens turned down for us and very, very soft pens given against. red cards not given for horror tackles against and yellows given for legal tackles by our players. the club has used this statement by the ref to try to prevent this ref from officiating any more of our games. a bit of reading of facts will also inform you that this was that refs first game at everton for 6 years, after he gave loads of poor, no downright wrong decisions in an everton Liverpool derby, again including awarding pens for Liverpool which were dubious and not for everton which were stonewall, everton complained and he was kept away. this was his first game back and he didn't want to upset everton and their fans again. we should have had 2 pens and they should have had a player sent off, and hats expert pundits words not mine. so why did he book a saints player for arguing the second turned down penalty and then say what he said to him? did he book the player because he thinks the player has become a big time Charlie? would he have booked the player if he hadn't played for England? the exact words of the ref still haven't been released so your also, along with the media, jumping to conclusions. why wont the refs bosses have an enquiry? are they trying to cover up again? don't forget this is the same ref that was `cleared` of racially abusing a Chelski player.
you should concentrate on your own club and its inability to stage games.
[quote][p][bold]Blackwaterblue[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP![/p][/quote]the player didn't complain, you should read the article and then realise that the club complained. you wont also know that this ref has consistently given poor decisions against our club, stonewall pens turned down for us and very, very soft pens given against. red cards not given for horror tackles against and yellows given for legal tackles by our players. the club has used this statement by the ref to try to prevent this ref from officiating any more of our games. a bit of reading of facts will also inform you that this was that refs first game at everton for 6 years, after he gave loads of poor, no downright wrong decisions in an everton Liverpool derby, again including awarding pens for Liverpool which were dubious and not for everton which were stonewall, everton complained and he was kept away. this was his first game back and he didn't want to upset everton and their fans again. we should have had 2 pens and they should have had a player sent off, and hats expert pundits words not mine. so why did he book a saints player for arguing the second turned down penalty and then say what he said to him? did he book the player because he thinks the player has become a big time Charlie? would he have booked the player if he hadn't played for England? the exact words of the ref still haven't been released so your also, along with the media, jumping to conclusions. why wont the refs bosses have an enquiry? are they trying to cover up again? don't forget this is the same ref that was `cleared` of racially abusing a Chelski player. you should concentrate on your own club and its inability to stage games. el caballo santos101
  • Score: 1

12:37pm Sun 5 Jan 14

Stroppy_gramps says...

I still think there is more to this than the comment that person allegedly said to Lallana.
the words currently in the public domain are those released by PGMOL - no one else. This person has had several complaints laid against him over the years, some of them have been incredibly serious and yet each time he has not really been held to account. There is no smoke without fire.

Do you honestly believe that a multi-million pound operation in ANY industry or sport would complain if the statement this person is alleged to have said to Lallana is the whole matter? Our club is not being run by idiots and they quite clearly believe they have a case to pursue here which is why they are considering taking it further.
Just consider how the club dealt with those idiots who tried to leave a skate shirt behind some plasterboard at Staplewood - they didn't hang about and then they moved on from it. Osvaldo - they appealed against the ban because they felt they had a case. It was found against them and they have accepted it and moved on.
I think there is more to this - it is not merely a point proving exercise.

And I will confirm what you are thinking - I will not refer to that person as a referee because in my view he should not be. He is not fair, he is not impartial and I truly believe that he has made decisions to the detriment of Saints over a sustained period of time.
I still think there is more to this than the comment that person allegedly said to Lallana. the words currently in the public domain are those released by PGMOL - no one else. This person has had several complaints laid against him over the years, some of them have been incredibly serious and yet each time he has not really been held to account. There is no smoke without fire. Do you honestly believe that a multi-million pound operation in ANY industry or sport would complain if the statement this person is alleged to have said to Lallana is the whole matter? Our club is not being run by idiots and they quite clearly believe they have a case to pursue here which is why they are considering taking it further. Just consider how the club dealt with those idiots who tried to leave a skate shirt behind some plasterboard at Staplewood - they didn't hang about and then they moved on from it. Osvaldo - they appealed against the ban because they felt they had a case. It was found against them and they have accepted it and moved on. I think there is more to this - it is not merely a point proving exercise. And I will confirm what you are thinking - I will not refer to that person as a referee because in my view he should not be. He is not fair, he is not impartial and I truly believe that he has made decisions to the detriment of Saints over a sustained period of time. Stroppy_gramps
  • Score: 1

1:01pm Sun 5 Jan 14

Sadoldgitte says...

Blackwaterblue wrote:
I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP!
I agree. If players who abused refs weren't welcome at following games we would be down to 5 a side matches most weeks.
If this was the comment made is is hardly abuse - just an observational remark by a referee. If the club want to take issue about his decsions then so be it, but this complain makes us look petty and childish.
[quote][p][bold]Blackwaterblue[/bold] wrote: I can't believe that someone is complaining about this remark! It's not an insult at all. What do players say to referees and get away with? I just don't believe that a Saints player has complained: some where in the Saints is a non footballing person who needs a few words in his ear. This makes Saints a laughing stock: even Matt LeTis think so. PuP![/p][/quote]I agree. If players who abused refs weren't welcome at following games we would be down to 5 a side matches most weeks. If this was the comment made is is hardly abuse - just an observational remark by a referee. If the club want to take issue about his decsions then so be it, but this complain makes us look petty and childish. Sadoldgitte
  • Score: 1

6:25pm Sun 5 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

A statement in the Daily Mail today explaining the Saints view

http://www.dailymail
.co.uk/sport/foo...-
decision.html

When Riley asked Clattenburg and his officials from Goodison Park about the Lallana incident, they all responded by corroborating the referee’s version of events. He didn't apparently ask anyone else, there may have been reliable witnesses who would offer evidence to the contrary. When in the name of justice do you have Judge and Jury and witnesses who are all on one side of the fence?
A statement in the Daily Mail today explaining the Saints view http://www.dailymail .co.uk/sport/foo...- decision.html When Riley asked Clattenburg and his officials from Goodison Park about the Lallana incident, they all responded by corroborating the referee’s version of events. He didn't apparently ask anyone else, there may have been reliable witnesses who would offer evidence to the contrary. When in the name of justice do you have Judge and Jury and witnesses who are all on one side of the fence? OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 2

4:07am Mon 6 Jan 14

batesieboy says...

"You've changed."
"You haven't. You are still a very poor referee who is not impartial and takes sides."
"You've changed." "You haven't. You are still a very poor referee who is not impartial and takes sides." batesieboy
  • Score: 0

9:49am Mon 6 Jan 14

Blackwaterblue says...

I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage.
I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage. Blackwaterblue
  • Score: 0

1:40pm Mon 6 Jan 14

OSPREYSAINT says...

Blackwaterblue wrote:
I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage.
Well when we find out who it is, we will have to consider it. none of your business though, I think you need to get your own problems sorted before offering us unwanted advice.
[quote][p][bold]Blackwaterblue[/bold] wrote: I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage.[/p][/quote]Well when we find out who it is, we will have to consider it. none of your business though, I think you need to get your own problems sorted before offering us unwanted advice. OSPREYSAINT
  • Score: 0

3:42pm Mon 6 Jan 14

st1halo says...

Blackwaterblue wrote:
I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage.
I'm not embarrased. The man is a useless and biased referee and imo is corrupt in his private life and his professional one. You have to ask yourself what were the chances of him awarding a penalty against a team that had him banned and where he had been forbidden from appearing for 6 years for incompetence? At worst we will get a little bad press soon forgotten. At best, the PGMOL the FA and ourselves will be scrutanising his games with us a lot more closely in future, and hopefully better performances from him are assured.

STID
[quote][p][bold]Blackwaterblue[/bold] wrote: I'm a Skate and I discussed this with a Saints friend over the weekend. Was he totally embarrassed? You bet he was. We bot agree that whoever is driving this forward at Saints is not a footballing person. Get him out before he does more damage.[/p][/quote]I'm not embarrased. The man is a useless and biased referee and imo is corrupt in his private life and his professional one. You have to ask yourself what were the chances of him awarding a penalty against a team that had him banned and where he had been forbidden from appearing for 6 years for incompetence? At worst we will get a little bad press soon forgotten. At best, the PGMOL the FA and ourselves will be scrutanising his games with us a lot more closely in future, and hopefully better performances from him are assured. STID st1halo
  • Score: 0

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